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Well I finally have the draft designs of the Jacks for the new 52Ravens deck, BLOOD. Its a nickname at the moment but I think it will stick.

Once again I lay these designs before you all and encourage you to pull them apart. I really enjoyed working like this with you all on The Coven deck, as a fresh pair of eyes will always see something I’ve overlooked.

So the theme is clearly vampires, all female and I’m not hiding that fact with masks this time. The Jacks will look like they have just feed, The queens will be beautiful like wolves in sheeps clothing (except the QoH, something evil planned for her) and the kings will have veins as though they are older or dying.

I was thinking of giving them all names? Not something that would totally stand out but subtle and faded, maybe top right? My main thought behind this is I like the idea of all these women living in an old country manor, luring man to their deaths in a kind of ‘Brides of Dracula’ meets ‘From Dust Till Dawn’. Well thats the story I’ve pictured as inspiration.

There is no finished back design as of yet, struggling for ideas for a main focus, do say if you have any thoughts. I have some ideas already but most are only half finished as I’m not loving them.

The old age paper effect is back, darker and more prominent. I know people are going to complain but its going to have to stay. Vampires are old, mythological and legendary, the only way to have “documented" something like this is in a book. So for me it works. A plain, clean and modern design just doesn't fit. Plus, the main plan is to have the box in a matte black with embossing and silver/gold foil in the design of a book cover. So hopefully it should tie it all together. (ok rant over as to why the old age look is staying ha ha)

Thanks for taking the time to look this over, I’d love to here your thoughts and suggestions

What about mixing your idea with something like this;

I like the idea of blood spatters but in order to keep it a mirrored deck I was running into issues. It looked over repeated but I think I'll use it as a joker option.

I'm happy to see you revisiting the mythological/esoterical themes. Coven came out great! (Just received them in the mail so thanks for that )

I REALLY like what I'm seeing here. And I agree that the old book look really adds to it especially with your idea of making the tuck look like a centuries old tome.

As for the names, I'm 50/50 on board with it. I was thinking of something like small plaques at the bottom of their portraits perhaps?

And I was also thinking they could be "old" sounding names, i.e Victorian names like..I don't know, Countess Wilhelmina Baker or something like that.

Just like Coven, I am SUPER excited for this deck.

I love the hair texture, and also how you incorporated the traditional Jack weapons/artifacts.

I agree with Eoghann and feeling 50/50 on the names. Nat Iwata's Vintage Vampires deck is - as the name implies - also about vampires, and he had placed the respective names at the center of the court cards on a banner. I don't know if you were thinking of doing that, or writing them on the sides like jokers cards, etc. - just ideas

Eoghann wrote:I'm 50/50 on board with it. I was thinking of something like small plaques at the bottom of their portraits perhaps? And I was also thinking they could be "old" sounding names, i.e Victorian names like..I don't know, Countess Wilhelmina Baker or something like that.

jaytayo2212 wrote:I agree with Eoghann and feeling 50/50 on the names.

Thanks guys. Yeah I'm the same, I like the idea of naming them but could just as easily leave it off. Defiantly old english names (Countess, Lad, Duchess) if I did do it. Maybe a couple of examples of what it will look like might help. I'll post some soon.

Hope you're having fun with The Coven

If names are used could they be handwritten, rather like personal signatures of the vampire ladies?

Personally I like the aged look - it just doesn't work well when the pattern repeats, as you were saying about the blood spatter. Could each card be different?

Perhaps the old book look of the tuck could be echoed by the backs? Tucks usually feature the backs and it sounds like you are thinking of the cards as pages or illustrations from a book.

Are there any alchemical symbols and beliefs that can be linked to vampires, like blood connections? An old esoterical book may have such things on it's cover and the same symbols could be worked into the courts as well. Here's an interesting conversation I found on alchemy and vampirism:
http://forum.alchemyforums.com/showthre ... mp-Alchemy

I still find the women rather modern. It may be the finely sculpted eyebrows and rather idealized Western features. None of them has a prominant nose or different shaped face to suggest varied older cultures they may have been "born" out of as vampires. The undead beauty would appear in many forms.

dazzleguts wrote:If names are used could they be handwritten, rather like personal signatures of the vampire ladies?

Great minds think alike, I thought a signature would look cool to. I'll do one like that and one as a serif font. I'll post some examples next.

Symbols is going to be the way to go I think with that back, but with a mix of floral gothic shapes. Check out the image link below, its to an unfinished deck design I have but didn't feel it fit in the vampire theme, maybe I'll take elements from this. (I don't want to post the image as it might confuse things)
http://www.52ravens.com/forumimages/blood/back1.jpg

I get what you mean about the women looking modern. There should be some variation but a can't get pass the fact that you should find them attractive. haha I know thats deeply shallow of me but at the end of the day they have to be appealing to the eye I think.

I have the Queens of hearts for you all to look at today...the red queen.

Let me know what you think.

We're all thinking it - bloody amazing! And also very attractive

Just a thought - while I love the small heart between the eyebrows and how fine/thin the hair is - when proofs come just take a check there to make sure color doesn't radiate out too much and ruin the detail

OK...well the earlier vampires clearly had just eaten and had blood drool. Totally makes sense, but what happened to this QoH? Bobbing for hearts in a tank of blood? Even if, seems odd the entire face and hair would be PERFECTLY coated, shouldn't it be more like the rest of the torso and splotchy? Just seems artificial and goofy to me right now.

Thanks for the heads up jaytayo2212, after getting the proofs for the coven deck I know how far I can push EPCC. But you've right, the top of the hair on the QoH might be a little tight

Any advances on "goofy" for the QoH? If so I'll change it. The idea was that she had it poured on her but if it doesn't look right I'll take another look.

So the Jacks have just eaten, the Kings are veiny...any smart ideas for the queens?

What if the Queens cry blood?

It looks much better...maybe show a little fang too

shermjack wrote:maybe show a little fang too

Breaking through the smirk, I like it

Much better, brings back memories of True Blood.

I have to disagree, sorry! I think the gory one goes really well with the Queen of Hearts. True that it needs a but of, maybe, texture on the blood in her hair, but i like the over-the-top bloob bath. If one card can be excessive in this deck, it's this one.
You can use the red tears in another Queen.
As for the link between Queens, it can be the luscious enjoyment of blood and feast. Jacks are gluttony, hunger, Kings strength and rage, Queens pure joy and lust. What do you think?

The first one maybe has TOO much blood, and on the second one, the blood tears just look kinda Goth/Emo to me. I'm leaning towards the blood soaked one though but I'm not too crazy about the slicked back hair. Perhaps she can be licking her lips whilst showing some fangs?

I love the viciousness of the Jacks, and I get that you're trying to amp the fierceness on the Queens. But maybe if she weren't so calm about it? Perhaps a more smug or taunting expression.

Are you familiar with the American Vampire graphic novels? I really liked how they portrayed Pearl Jones for instance. One minute she's beautiful and "innocent", then her true form is horrific and savage. There's also a game called Bloodmasque that portrays the Victorian beauties you're aiming for but the vampires are really centuries old and their true forms are monstrous.

Ooh, and how about making the red rose have a little drop hanging from it?

I think a good progression would be that the Jacks are gorgeous yet deadly, and the higher the rank goes; the more the vampires will reveal their true, ancient forms.

I have to agree with Daniel. I'd like to see a physical transformation of some sort, in the courts if possible, but even if only in the jokers. Also prefer the blood soaked one, if only for the interesting look. The blood around the shoulders looks like it was painted on. I think poured over her it would look more like Carrie from the movie, more varied with a few glints of hair through and less blood on the shoulders.

I wasn't arguing for ugliness so much as variation in beauty. A few that are more exotic.

Cool you like my signature idea

The other back is a bit rigid for this - gridded and mandela like - but it does suggest old book cover.

52Ravens - Let's have some fun like last time. I like your theme. Old, Beautiful, and Feed. All women vampires. I notice you want your QoH to stand out or be special. Your QoH has a frontal position. Give her a Janet Jackson boob. Give the QoH one boob. In my next deck I'm going to show a boob.

skip to 5:20...Wardrobe malfunction my ass.

I think you're all right, the jacks are already at the same level, as though they've just feed. The queens need to be a little more evil (maybe just more blood as though the feed was a struggle, and they are obsessed with the lust for blood) expect the QoH who needs to be drenched in blood, somewhere in-between the two I already have. And the Kings need to be more feral and monster like, kind of a bumpy face vampire from Buffy meets the dying Dracula.

Eoghann wrote:Are you familiar with the American Vampire graphic novels?

Yeah the novels have been on my radar, but I didn't want to over look at them as I know I'd inadvertatly draw too much from it. But you're right, Pearl has all the stages that need to be on each level for the jacks, queens and kings.

I haven't heard of the game, I like the victorian beauties but the true monster form looks a little too far for me Its a pain as I can't get the game here in the UK

sprouts1115 wrote:show a boob

haha, this won't be happening

With all that said about the levels and QoH blood, I will post the names later today

Thanks guys

What do you think?

I like the handwritten aspect of number 4 a lot, but that makes it look like a sketchbook (kind of like the Avernum deck by Passione) which I understand is not the look you're going for this time around. You're going for an old book on vampires, yes?

I think the fonts may be a little too modern for the design. Maybe some gothic style or is that too cliché?:

http://99designs.com/designer-blog/2012 ... -of-style/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

At any rate, a more antique typeface should tie in better, like 3 and 5 which make it look like an illustration on an old book.

I agree: how about some of these as suggestions:

http://new.myfonts.com/fonts/glc/1420-gothic-script/
http://www.myfonts.com/fonts/wiescherdesign/eddy/
http://www.myfonts.com/fonts/typo5/californya/
http://new.myfonts.com/fonts/paratype/federico/
http://www.myfonts.com/fonts/mvbfonts/sacre-bleu/
http://www.myfonts.com/fonts/3ip/lamar-pen/
http://www.myfonts.com/fonts/3ip/emily-austin/
http://www.myfonts.com/fonts/itc/johann-sparkling/
http://www.myfonts.com/fonts/glc/1815-waterloo/
http://new.myfonts.com/fonts/glc/1885-germinal/

Nice selection Joe!

As an old signature I'm partial to the dramatic Californya, but would it be legible? All of the fonts with low x-heights (lower case letters being short) may not work well at the scale of the card face (example #2 above).

A thought: if they were the signatures of the vampires themselves each would have to have a different style.

If this was an early one-of-a-kind book it would have been hand written by the author, including the names, and for sheer age I like the 1420 Gothic, though it may be hard to read. Daniel's Carolingian miniscule might work better as a gothic.

The Lamar is very readable, while still having an old fashioned, though not ancient, feel.

52Ravens - So, you want to sign your deck. It's interesting that you picked the JoC


or is going to be on all the courts? This guy did it on all his courts


I feel you all missing something here under the suit index for the theme. Maybe an upside down cross or symbol for vampires.

Thanks for all the suggestions, really useful

I've attached 4 more to look at. I like 1 but I think an old English font like this might clash with the main font. I think 2 and 4 are the better ones. 2 might be best as 4 looks too much like a signature, the vampires won't of signed the book. 2 looks more like handwriting like the "Survival" book on vampires is hand written. What do you think?

I was planing on offering up the naming (pending terms and conditions, and my final approval) of the courts to higher ranked pledges on kickstater, BUT I think its only fair that you name them for helping out. They still need to be old english names and not ladies or duchess as it would be a state of emergency if 12 titled women got turned into vampires. So if you've offered an opinion, feel free to post a name you would like to use, pending terms and conditions, and my final approval. Check this out for a laugh or if you get stuck, most of these will pass http://fantasynamegenerators.com/posh-names.php" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

sprouts1115 - all the courts will be named. The naming is already going outside of my own personal rules for making the cards useful for playing and magic, so I think adding anything underneath the suit index might be taking it too far for me.

Why not have them as the vampire's signatures, each having their own style and perhaps having a little of their character reflecting in the signature as well?

volantangel wrote:Why not have them as the vampire's signatures, each having their own style and perhaps having a little of their character reflecting in the signature as well?

I like the idea that they are all signed by the vampires, that way I could use 2-4 on the last examples. But would vampires have signed this "book"?

What does everyone else think?

52Ravens wrote:

volantangel wrote:Why not have them as the vampire's signatures, each having their own style and perhaps having a little of their character reflecting in the signature as well?

I like the idea that they are all signed by the vampires, that way I could use 2-4 on the last examples. But would vampires have signed this "book"?

What does everyone else think?

Actually, this deck of cards was created by a legendary vampire hunter in 1613 and were handed out to proprietors of hotels, brothels, taverns, etc. He included drawings of the vampires and was able to gather signatures from them from past victim's guest registries which were included on the cards. This, along with related ad cards giving details of the demeanor and unique markings of each vampire, should provide ample information for those still living to be aware of the most dangerous vampires and take appropriate steps to fend them off before accepting them into their establishments.

Actually, this deck of cards was created by a legendary vampire hunter in 1613 and were handed out to proprietors of hotels, brothels, taverns, etc. He included drawings of the vampires and was able to gather signatures from them from past victim's guest registries which were included on the cards. This, along with related ad cards giving details of the demeanor and unique markings of each vampire, should provide ample information for those still living to be aware of the most dangerous vampires and take appropriate steps to fend them off before accepting them into their establishments.

Wow! Combine the deck with this story = awesome!