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My father and I have collaborated with an artist to make the tribal deck. We are in kickstarter prelaunch and will up within the next 2 to 3 weeks. Please follow us at https://www.facebook.com/premonitioncustomplayingcards" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; to see what is happening! Thanks guys.

Welcome to UC and thanks for the heads up!

It would be great if you could post some more, and more detailed, images of your deck. If you are looking for feedback before you launch, you'll get plenty of it here...

Welcome to UC! I'll jump in. The art on the courts looks very well done, the gray background leaves me flat. Would like either white or a softer, lighter shade of an earth tone like a tan or khaki- would seem to fit the theme better. Gray is industrial. Bunch of folks here gonna want thin borders.

I didn't know my nickname was "Bunch of folks"

I agree on the background, looks like sement and it doesn't really add to the feel of the deck. And if that changes, I would like to see the same color on the back design change along with it.

Interesting artwork though, I don't think anyone has done a good native american themed deck before <thumbs up>

Well there's this...





I also agree - the designs are colourful, vivid and pretty well done. But that's stymied by popping them on an industrial grey background. (Perhaps that's a comment on the historical plight of the Native American Indian people?)

Hello,

I look the cards on the picture displayed on the initial post and here are my reviews :
- As others, background (color and style) can be improved ;
- Figures on courts seems "flats" without relief. Colors appears to be without gradation (or scale - sorry, my english vocabulary is limited) and there is no light and shadow effects.
- Design of Figures on courts are a bit simple/childish...
- Back of cards is too grey...

I cant' see the facebook page for the moment (web surfing limitations at work). Perhaps there are something that would change my opinion.

My two euro cents

[EDIT] I go to facebook page. Cards are in high resolution. I keep my reviews above...

I would add that the border color of the front of the cards (which is now grey) should always match the border color of the back (which is now white), IMO. And yes- please lose the grey.

Living in California where there is a strong Native American population I can tell you that this deck will greatly offend a lot of people. Not me, I'm not Native American. But people protested Urban Outfitters when they used a Navajo pattern on one of there shirts one time. How do you think people will react to someone putting non tribe specific tomahawk wielding warriors on decks of playing cards? Native American tribes fight hard against this type of stereotyping. If I were the creator I would run it by some Native Americans he doesn't know and get their opinions. Maybe go to a forum online where they can check it out. Even the Cleveland Indians are taking Chief Wahoo off their hats and replacing it with the letter "C". Just a thought!

PRM19XX wrote:Living in California where there is a strong Native American population I can tell you that this deck will greatly offend a lot of people. Not me, I'm not Native American. But people protested Urban Outfitters when they used a Navajo pattern on one of there shirts one time. How do you think people will react to someone putting non tribe specific tomahawk wielding warriors on decks of playing cards? Native American tribes fight hard against this type of stereotyping. If I were the creator I would run it by some Native Americans he doesn't know and get their opinions. Maybe go to a forum online where they can check it out. Even the Cleveland Indians are taking Chief Wahoo off their hats and replacing it with the letter "C". Just a thought!

US is a difficult country to understand for a European (at the other side, Europe is certainly difficult to understand for a US citizen).

Here indian without bird's feather on head or tomahawk in hand is like a french without béret or baguette/french stick. it's a idealized image (or a cliché) of indians for us (in french we say a "image d'Epinal"). Surely there must be european sport teams with indians as logo...

But we have our controversy too about the use of pictures of black people by some brands (Banania for example).

You're right, it's a complicated issue. I just checked out Banania, yup, they would have to change that mascot if they released it in the US market. But at least the modern version seems pretty harmless.

MagikFingerz wrote:I didn't know my nickname was "Bunch of folks"

I agree on the background, looks like sement and it doesn't really add to the feel of the deck. And if that changes, I would like to see the same color on the back design change along with it.

Interesting artwork though, I don't think anyone has done a good native american themed deck before <thumbs up>

Here is one. Is it all right if I call you Bunch for short?

As to the comments about offending, I believe the Arrowhead deck I show below was made for First Nations owned casinos. They do seem more thoughtful about costume and culture of the various tribes:

dazzleguts wrote:

MagikFingerz wrote:I didn't know my nickname was "Bunch of folks"

I agree on the background, looks like sement and it doesn't really add to the feel of the deck. And if that changes, I would like to see the same color on the back design change along with it.

Interesting artwork though, I don't think anyone has done a good native american themed deck before <thumbs up>

Here is one. Is it all right if I call you Bunch for short?

As to the comments about offending, I believe the Arrowhead deck I show below was made for First Nations owned casinos. They do seem more thoughtful about costume and culture of the various tribes:

you also have to take into account they were designing a deck so that they could take money from the white man. I would still buy that deck over this one coming to KS though.

Where can we get the Casino Regina deck, can't seem to find it online anywhere?

PRM19XX wrote:Living in California where there is a strong Native American population I can tell you that this deck will greatly offend a lot of people. Not me, I'm not Native American. But people protested Urban Outfitters when they used a Navajo pattern on one of there shirts one time. How do you think people will react to someone putting non tribe specific tomahawk wielding warriors on decks of playing cards? Native American tribes fight hard against this type of stereotyping. If I were the creator I would run it by some Native Americans he doesn't know and get their opinions. Maybe go to a forum online where they can check it out. Even the Cleveland Indians are taking Chief Wahoo off their hats and replacing it with the letter "C". Just a thought!

Stand back, folks - I get a clear shot at this one: being Cherokee native American by birth ((I haven't gone there yet, but - great-grandfather was 100%, named "Lute" (Luther) Redd)), I can say that this is one argument that I clearly see both sides of and you will never make everybody happy. It's like asking Atlanta to quit being the "Braves" or Dallas to quit being the "Cowboys". It's not just something about heritage, it's being comfortable in it. I'll be the first to say that we really screwed the native American population, no question about that part, but I'll also be the first to line up on the side of the "get real" and "this has nothing to do with really keeping native American heritage 'pure'", because it's as American as apple pie. Maybe the Redskins need to be "Crooked politicians", not certain? If the Indians aren't going to have the Chief any more, what's the point? I'm kind of baffled by how anyone can claim that this - in ANY way - infringes on the right to enjoy being a descendent of native Americans (or any other argument, and I've heard them all - multiple times). It just doesn't, period - and that's a fact. Argue all you or anybody wants to, you'll never 'sell' this idea to me! Now, the cards? Yep, I could use a few, and sure - they could use a little work, I'll admit - but the basics, surely it's all in there!

Taking weapons and such out of depictions of Native Americans hands is re-writing history to appease an over sensitive few. Thats's like saying we went into WWII with flowers in our hair and sang Kumbaya with the Germans. I'm not sure the majority of Native Americans would like to be thought of as pansies, their strong will and fighting spirit is part of their proud history.

The "Arrowhead" courts have been designed to have all the correct head, hand and weapon positions of traditional cards, so they do show weapons. You can see more of the cards here:
http://a.trionfi.eu/WWPCM/decks13/d11811/d11811.htm" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

vmagic wrote:Where can we get the Casino Regina deck, can't seem to find it online anywhere?

I've come across 2 decks in 2 different thrift stores here in Canada. One I sold to Casual Pixels a while back through ebay or I would offer it to you now vmagic. These were initially made in 1995, and were made for many different casinos, as you can see through the link above, so you could watch for an old deck on ebay. I found a newer set for sale here but it doesn't seem to be active. Might be a lead though:
http://www.wldwind.com/cards.htm" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Back to the deck at hand - I have to agree the grey is not working. The court figures could also use more detail so they are less cartoony and more like real people. All in all a miss for me.

Mike Ratledge wrote:

PRM19XX wrote:Living in California where there is a strong Native American population I can tell you that this deck will greatly offend a lot of people. Not me, I'm not Native American. But people protested Urban Outfitters when they used a Navajo pattern on one of there shirts one time. How do you think people will react to someone putting non tribe specific tomahawk wielding warriors on decks of playing cards? Native American tribes fight hard against this type of stereotyping. If I were the creator I would run it by some Native Americans he doesn't know and get their opinions. Maybe go to a forum online where they can check it out. Even the Cleveland Indians are taking Chief Wahoo off their hats and replacing it with the letter "C". Just a thought!

Stand back, folks - I get a clear shot at this one: being Cherokee native American by birth ((I haven't gone there yet, but - great-grandfather was 100%, named "Lute" (Luther) Redd)), I can say that this is one argument that I clearly see both sides of and you will never make everybody happy. It's like asking Atlanta to quit being the "Braves" or Dallas to quit being the "Cowboys". It's not just something about heritage, it's being comfortable in it. I'll be the first to say that we really screwed the native American population, no question about that part, but I'll also be the first to line up on the side of the "get real" and "this has nothing to do with really keeping native American heritage 'pure'", because it's as American as apple pie. Maybe the Redskins need to be "Crooked politicians", not certain? If the Indians aren't going to have the Chief any more, what's the point? I'm kind of baffled by how anyone can claim that this - in ANY way - infringes on the right to enjoy being a descendent of native Americans (or any other argument, and I've heard them all - multiple times). It just doesn't, period - and that's a fact. Argue all you or anybody wants to, you'll never 'sell' this idea to me! Now, the cards? Yep, I could use a few, and sure - they could use a little work, I'll admit - but the basics, surely it's all in there!

However, well researched history and accurate, sensitive artwork is far more attractive to laymen such as I than generic cartoon 'wawa indians'

We are taking the advice about the grey coloring. Our artist felt that it enhanced the colors of the cards, but we are up to improvements.

We are not trying to be offensive, I am a Native American flute player and really enjoy it and other aspects of Native American culture. I wanted to create a card deck and put two and two together. I in no way have tried to represent a single tribe or what have you. It is my first go at this and I just wanted to make something creative that is not to cartoony, but not like it came out of a museum either.

I should have white cards here soon to show you guys soon. I hope you like them better than the grey.
Thanks guys.

premonitioncards wrote:We are taking the advice about the grey coloring. Our artist felt that it enhanced the colors of the cards, but we are up to improvements.

We are not trying to be offensive, I am a Native American flute player and really enjoy it and other aspects of Native American culture. I wanted to create a card deck and put two and two together. I in no way have tried to represent a single tribe or what have you. It is my first go at this and I just wanted to make something creative that is not to cartoony, but not like it came out of a museum either.

I should have white cards here soon to show you guys soon. I hope you like them better than the grey.
Thanks guys.

Looking forward to seeing it!

Ditto.

On a related note, something posted above made me think about a possible theme for a deck: the day the Allies won the Nazis over with Flowers and Love. I dig alternate history....

MagikFingerz wrote:I didn't know my nickname was "Bunch of folks"

I agree on the background, looks like sement and it doesn't really add to the feel of the deck. And if that changes, I would like to see the same color on the back design change along with it.

Interesting artwork though, I don't think anyone has done a good native american themed deck before <thumbs up>

There have been some. My favorite is the Fournier America deck:

http://prefundia.com/projects/view/tribal-deck/720/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; We have listened to advice from different locations and here is our update.

Much better! Artwork pops, gray was dragging it down.

Project now live

Yes we are live! Thank you for posting the update

I see they failed to listen to comments regarding the color of the back. And it's pretty pricey for international, probably will keep backers away.

I like the back design, not so much the color. And I'm not a huge fan of the tuck. Don't know why the back design is on the front? Kinda boring all together. I like the designs on the cards though! Cool pips and the courts are decent.. maybe a little too much negative space.

I'm not well versed on how the KS process goes yet, but I gotta ask, is it unusual for there to be $4610 added to a project with no new backers in one day (4/27)

Be afraid, be very afraid..

volantangel wrote:Be afraid, be very afraid..

I am aferred.. Hold me.