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CBJ wrote:

jerichoholic wrote:And i'm sure in both cases its just a way to get people to spend more money.

This is the goal of every business.

True the goal of every business is to make money, but I say let the decks/tucks you already have sell themselves, instead of making more artificially limited decks. One can still make money without additional tucks.

jerichoholic wrote:artificially limited decks

Hi Victor!

How's that a thing? If something is limited, it's limited. It can be "artificially limited", because then it's not limited at all. Then it's standard.

jerichoholic wrote:

CBJ wrote:

jerichoholic wrote:And i'm sure in both cases its just a way to get people to spend more money.

This is the goal of every business.

True the goal of every business is to make money, but I say let the decks/tucks you already have sell themselves, instead of making more artificially limited decks. One can still make money without additional tucks.

Victor,

If you're not into multiple variants, only buy the one(s) you like, or don't purchase at all.. it's your choice.
There are plenty of people who do not feel the way you do, that's why creators keep making variants.

You've expressed your feelings on this issue, and I don't think you need to keep re-hashing it.


Jay

Let's not paint Victor in a worse light than necessary. This is not a new issue, there's always been people - on this very forum - who is less than impressed at multiple swap tucks. I can't say I like it very much either, but it's become so commonplace nowadays that I don't even bother commenting on it anymore.

Just like we got to a point where one couldn't get every new deck that came out anymore, I'm honestly hoping for the bubble to burst on the LE/Super LE/Ultra LE market as well. As people continue to collect, their tastes refine and their priorities narrow. I think "not getting every version of each deck" is another step in a collector's growth, and thus this market may ultimately die away over time. But that's just my personal theory.

What I find more disconcerting is that our very own members offering consultation aren't pulling the reigns a bit. I know with fair certainty that to some extent they're actually promoting that type of project model. Granted, Mike and Kai's involvement is to guarantee success, even if it means resorting to these gimmicks. It's literally their job as Deck Refinery reps. But that still doesn't make it right.

An artist comes along: "I've got five designs and I can't decide which one"..and you guys answer "why not make them all?!" Make some limited tuck swaps of the same deck...boom, pow! You've cleaned house!

If overstock is the problem, and if these niche designs don't sell well enough to require a 2500 printing with USPCC; switch to a printer with a lower minimum! Legends and EPCC are good enough. From what I've learned, these aren't designs cardists or magicians will flock over and use for their routines, so going with these two should be perfectly fine for everyone else. I think it's a sensible compromise in quality.

Don't throw the responsibility on the backers to clear your overstock.

My honest opinion on multiple tucks with the same deck is that it's lazy, pure and simple. Three tucks with one deck is just as bad as five tucks with two decks. That's why I cancelled several pledges and won't pledge for some decks no matter how amazing the artwork is. Yes, I could just get one deck but then I'd still be supporting a project I am against. It is a much greater market now than it has been over the past few years and we can be picky about what decks we pledge for and/or purchase.

Eoghann wrote:What I find more disconcerting is that our very own members offering consultation aren't pulling the reigns a bit. I know with fair certainty that to some extent they're actually promoting that type of project model. Granted, Mike and Kai's involvement is to guarantee success, even if it means resorting to these gimmicks. It's literally their job as Deck Refinery reps. But that still doesn't make it right.

Well Dan to be fair i have never encouraged a simple tuckswap in any of the projects i have consulted with. Even in the case of signature editions, i always ask what is unique about this deck, and being handcrafted always adds a special little touch. In any case, i thought we were seeing a drop in these tuck swaps since EPCC dropped the minimum to 1000. Honestly i cant think of any projects where i been involved in that had tuckswaps (minus Sig Eds).

Hey guys, it seems there’s a little bit of background here with some members that I’m not privy to, but I don’t want any bad blood being spilled over opinions. I guess what I’m trying to say is it’s totally cool to have either negative or positive opinions, to each their own!

My comment to Victor was just a fun natured poke.  And, Jay’s comment was in defense of something he/we believe in (variants), just like some people don’t- which it totally fine.

I know how much effort and thought Jay has put into this project and it’s his baby just as much as it’s mine... a grotesque love child if you will  He came up with the genius idea to put the lenticular lens on the deck, and has really helped this project really across the board. From design advice, to font choices, to KS project page layout, he’s been involved every step of the way… He has driven me crazy, but in a good way!
Again, EVERYONE is entitled to their opinion, and this is a great place to sound them! With that said, there are a few things I’d like to address—in defense of the variant tucks.

One of the goals that I set out to accomplish when I first started making decks was to listen to people. Of course, that doesn't mean you can make EVERYONE happy, but there’s a lot of wisdom far beyond my knowledge out there and you have to be open to it. I've done my best to listen.

One of the first things said was to no longer hide the unlocks, especially the additional decks. People wanted to know how many decks were going to be on a project, so that they could chose whether or not they wanted to get involved. We have since done that.

Another notable point brought up in the past was that if you’re going to do tuck variants, make them drastically different with truly special elements, not just recolors. We've done embossing, foil stamping, foil stamping AND embossing, lenticular lens’, diecuts, hand signed decks, the list goes on… Again, we listened.

My point is simply that we've done a lot of work to listen to all of your input and really try to manage them accordingly. The above mentioned things are just a small note in everything that we've heard and adapted to our project plans, and your opinions really do matter. But, with that said, I think it’s also important to remember that an opinion is just that. While it’s natural to think that one’s opinion is the correct point of view, there are 100 others that disagree. Variants are common place, and generally the percentage of people enjoy the variety. If you don’t , that’s totally cool and within your rights! I would merely say that if you refuse to support something, even if you like it, then make sure somewhere in the back of your head you won’t regret it later.

Again, we’re never out to offend or upset anyone, because collecting cards is supposed to be fun! At the end of the day, it’s just a hobby. We make them, because we love it. However, we are also a business and making decks requires a lot of time, energy, and money, so we try to do what WE want while creating something that will bring joy to collectors.

As always, thanks! We will continue to create cool and inventive Kickstarter projects that we hope brings everyone a smile and something to talk about.

Update

Hey everyone! We've had a handful of messages sent to us requesting to see the jokers from the deck. Scott's been working hard to finish them up, and think you guys are really going to like them!

Here's the first one.







As you can see, we've got a hunter on our hands! These guys have a vendetta against the pack, and are out to stop them at risk of loss of life or limb!

We're slowly creeping up towards the next unlock, but let's try to spread the word as much as we can in order to get there a little quicker.

We've got a bunch of AWESOME stuff to unlock still, and would hate to not share them with you all, as some of the stuff is CRAZY AWESOME!

Let's keep rocking, and thank you all for your support so far!!!!

Just noticed that Crooked Kings are selling their decks on eBay for wayyyyyy less than the value I paid for the same decks on KS!!
It seems that with this guys its not worthy to help them funding their projects. Since this one is already funded, I'll just cancel my pledge and then buy it later from their eBay account, and thus saving a lot of money.

NOTE: They have all the right to do so, after all those are their decks and they can offer them if they want.
This is just a heads up for those who like to save money, like me!.

Nice! But I would prefer one-way jokers. With the aces already discussed, everything will looks like court cards. Maybe I'm too traditional, but I like courts, aces and jokers that look respectively like courts, aces and jokers. Easier to play with. But I'm still in!

Hey everyone! I hope you all are having a great day so far!

We wanted to share with you all the recently finished 2nd joker design for the deck!





I don't know who's more scary... there werewolf's or these guys!

On a side note, we're crunching some numbers and using an abacus to see if we can offer a very cool, but super limited add-on here in the next couple of days to you all. If it works out, I want you all to know that it will be super limited (like only 25ish) and will be a GREAT deal for those lucky enough to jump on it! We won't know for a few days, but I will give everyone a heads up prior to it being launched- so, keep an eye out for an update!

Update!

Wooden Box highlight:

Hey everyone! A handful of folks have messaged us asking for a closer look at the next unlock. Some of our newer backers aren't familiar with the quality that Crooked Kings produces, especially in these awesome 2 deck wooden holders, so we've opted to go ahead and cheat a little bit and give everyone a sneak peak! These aren't unlocked yet, but hopefully this may entice some folks to up there pledges a bit to unlock them sooner

So, here's a sneak peak of the next unlock!





These boxes are super sweet, and anyone who's backed our projects in the past can attest to that!

Boxes aren't for me but the craftsmanship and detail on that looks amazing.

I have the MADE and Vikings boxes. They fit a couple decks very well.

Crap you changed the back. I can't bitch and ask if this was some orb that looks up side down.
So, your back bleeds black out and so do your Fronts. They bleed black out on the top left of the card. I like the way you anticipated the bleed by making the the Hearts and Diamonds bleed black on the top. It's all black. You should have some interesting black bleeds on your top and bottom of deck.

The deal is out for some orbiter deck displays and some of Scott past decks

sprouts1115 wrote:So, your back bleeds black out and so do your Fronts. They bleed black out on the top left of the card. I like the way you anticipated the bleed by making the the Hearts and Diamonds bleed black on the top. It's all black. You should have some interesting black bleeds on your top and bottom of deck.

I'm glad you like it, man! Truthfully, I can't take credit for that though. Don Boyer from "the other forum" recommended that- it was a really smart suggestion!

louizz - Don knows his shit. Most of what he says is true. What ever he says is probably a good idea. I would have bitched if I saw a red bleed there. It would be a real conflict and you could not use this cards for poker. They would be marked. You're going to have a interesting black bleed from your deck, but on your next deck could you somehow put a bleed of red on the top right. You this symbol. Just a thought.
It would make the deck even more interesting to have both a black and red bleed. Seems Randy is the Master of Playing Cards of bleeds today. Your's is like 2D top and bottom and Randy's is like 3D.

So, I have a general question. What makes one buy an uncut sheet from a project? Or, rather not? Just curious. thanks!

hey bud... For me it was obviously the overall art including the backs.. The problem is that over the past year I have accumulated way too many uncuts and now it's like WTF do I do with them all. There are a few that I will frame but the wife is vetoing the hanging spots so in the end for me, no more uncuts unless the deck is a masterpiece of art

Thanks, brother! Anymore input from other folks would be great too!

louizz wrote:So, I have a general question. What makes one buy an uncut sheet from a project? Or, rather not? Just curious. thanks!

I think everyone has different criteria for uncuts. Mine are super narrow, the only one's I have are Emmanuel's transformation decks and a Tally Ho gaff deck (which beautifully displays the Tally Ho Circle and Fan backs, two of my favorite back designs). And even that is too many for me, I doubt I'll be able to showcase all of them any time soon.

louizz - Uncut sheets are just "fluff" items like T-shirts, dice, and wooden boxes. People just mainly want the decks. Sell them, but don't take a loss on them. Add-ons = Headache.

I SEE A BAD MOON RISING!

TODAY IS THE LUNAR ECLIPSE!





That means at 8PM (EST), that's 8PM in Virginia in the USA, an update will be sent out!

This update will have an item that will be made available in limited supply. 35 to be exact.

As far as I know, the item we're going to be offering has not been offered before ever, so we believe it to be truly unique.

As always, it will be first come first serve, so you will need to comment on the update itself to secure one.

To recap:

It will be limited to the first 35 who comment on the update. We will start a "drop-list" after that, so still comment if you want one.
Please, no other comments on the update, as it makes counting difficult
This will only be available tomorrow, so don’t hesitate!
Again, this will be released at 8PM (EST) – That’s 8PM East coast USA time

GET READY TO HUNT MY FRIENDS!!!!

HERE IT IS! GET EM' WHILE THEY'RE HOT, BECAUSE THEY'RE GONNA GO QUICK!


Like I said earlier, I don't believe anything like this has ever been offered before- forgive me if I'm wrong- but, I THINK IT'S A FIRST! So, without further ado...








***Link to the update: https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/cr ... ts/1189302" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;




Jay

Pretty cool twist to an uncut sheet.

Edit: Can't recall the exact dimensions of an uncut sheet but I'm assuming this is more of a "print" than an "uncut sheet of playing cards" since the uncut sheet is inseparable from everything else (?).

Its a pretty good price, but you probably need to have a heck load of wall space !

Yashi wrote:Pretty cool twist to an uncut sheet.

Edit: Can't recall the exact dimensions of an uncut sheet but I'm assuming this is more of a "print" than an "uncut sheet of playing cards" since the uncut sheet is inseparable from everything else (?).

Hey Yashi,


The uncut sheet is not attached. This is a frame that goes around the uncut.


Here is an example of what one looks like around a Bicycle Black Ghost 1st Edition:







I have mine framed the exact same way.

Oh I see. Damn, that's pretty cool.