New Dom/Int Shipping Options for Kickstarter

[JacksonRobinson]

I'm sure this is in the wrong thread but I thought it was worth posting.

https://www.kickstarter.com/blog/weve-m ... ship_email" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[rjtomlinson1977]

You beat me to the punch. I was just about to post the same thing!

[Stockholm17]

saw it! looks promising

[MagikFingerz]

Looks like this will make it possible to have separate US shipping as well. Very nice, I just hope people will use it.

[StanKindLee]

Looks like this will make it possible to have separate US shipping as well. Very nice, I just hope people will use it.

If KS card project creators don't start using location specific shipping rates, I imagine achieving funding will be even more difficult when compared with those who do.

What will be interesting to watch is how overall delivered deck prices will compare when looking at location specific shipping options versus the free worldwide shipping some projects are offering via joint US/Asian/Europian fulfillment centers.

[rjtomlinson1977]

Breaking shipping is the best thing KS has done. Now if they would only allow multiple pledge selections.

[Sher]

I think this is great. However, since US shipping has been built in before, I hope creators don't charge the normal $12-$15 *plus* shipping. I hope they remember to subtract US shipping from the deck price.

[albinodragon]

If KS card project creators don't start using location specific shipping rates, I imagine achieving funding will be even more difficult when compared with those who do.

Not necessarily, for most it should just mean lower goals (and hopefully more funded projects). If your goal is to raise enough to produce 2500 decks, it should be to produce 2500 decks, not produce 2500 decks AND ship some of them but we aren't sure how many so we've padded our final number.

As for shipping being broken down for the US, I love it. On projects like Dragon Crate it would have been easier to point out that you are paying $20 for the product and $10 for shipping in the US. The miniature alone for that project will be $15-$20 easy. But it was really hard to get anyone to separate the two, it looks like a $30 item.

Looking forward to trying this out with Breaking Bad soon.

[cherrynukacola]

Great news. Hope they add an option to separate shipping out from funding goal, too.

[Mike Ratledge]

Breaking shipping is the best thing KS has done. Now if they would only allow multiple pledge selections.

What novel concepts! Great ideas...

[Cbkimble]

I like this idea but at the same time many are going to complain about shipping, especially for one deck. You wanna do something better? Convince the USPS to make a smaller flat rate box that fits 1 to 2 bubble wrapped decks comfortably and cut the shipping by a third. The current small flat rate box costs $5.95. It can fit up 6 or 8 decks, depending on if they're bubble wrapped or not. This is becoming a big enough business, if someone talked to the USPS, they might start designing more boxes for shipping cards reducing shipping costs in the process.

[albinodragon]

I like this idea but at the same time many are going to complain about shipping, especially for one deck. You wanna do something better? Convince the USPS to make a smaller flat rate box that fits 1 to 2 bubble wrapped decks comfortably and cut the shipping by a third. The current small flat rate box costs $5.95. It can fit up 6 or 8 decks, depending on if they're bubble wrapped or not. This is becoming a big enough business, if someone talked to the USPS, they might start designing more boxes for shipping cards reducing shipping costs in the process.

USPS last year mailed 158.4 billion packages. To put this into perspective, I would guess we were one of the biggest shippers of decks last year and shipped about 20,000 packages. That accounts for 0.001% of all mail sent, not really enough to justify a separate shipping program.

To get lower shipping rates, over 75,000 priority packages have to be sent per year. And that's just to get a lower rate for something that they've already figured out and implemented.

[Mike Ratledge]

The problem is that the minimum cost for Priority Mail is $5.35, even for 1# (or less).

[StanKindLee]

If KS card project creators don't start using location specific shipping rates, I imagine achieving funding will be even more difficult when compared with those who do.

Not necessarily, for most it should just mean lower goals (and hopefully more funded projects). If your goal is to raise enough to produce 2500 decks, it should be to produce 2500 decks, not produce 2500 decks AND ship some of them but we aren't sure how many so we've padded our final number.

Great news. Hope they add an option to separate shipping out from funding goal, too.

As long as projects have to deliver rewards, the shipping cost whether broken out from tier level pricing or not will still have to be part of the funding goal, or the case of lots of projects funding but unable to deliver rewards will happen. Unless it is being suggested that all money collected as shipping fees never be shown to the general public, and that doesn't seem very transparent.

[Cbkimble]

As long as projects have to deliver rewards, the shipping cost whether broken out from tier level pricing or not will still have to be part of the funding goal, or the case of lots of projects funding but unable to deliver rewards will happen. Unless it is being suggested that all money collected as shipping fees never be shown to the general public, and that doesn't seem very transparent.

I disagree. I don't think they should be a part of the funding goal. That way the goal is exactly what is needed. Keep the shipping separate so the there is no excuse for not having the necessary funds to purchase everything and be able to ship.

[StanKindLee]

So you are suggesting that all money collected as shipping fees never be shown to the public?

[MagikFingerz]

So you are suggesting that all money collected as shipping fees never be shown to the public?

This is just a silly and unnecessarily provocative question. That's obviously not what he said, and I think it's safe to assume that nobody would want any of the collected money to be hidden.

Why do you read "separated" as "hidden"?

[Sher]

Ex. If goal is $10,000 for one print run, not including shipping, and the KS goal is only $10,000 (because the creator did not factor in shipping, which tends to happen), if the creator reaches funding at $10,100, he still needs to allocate part of that $10,100 to shipping, say around $1,000. So he's left with $9,100 which obviously isn't enough for printing. Or he can use all $10,000 for printing and only have $100 left for shipping, so he's stuck with all these decks. If you separate the shipping so that only the price of the product counts towards the $10,000 goal (and the money collected from shipping is shown has a separate amount on the page), the creator will less likely fall into the common dilemma of lack of shipping funds.

Of course this could also be avoided by including estimated shipping costs into the funding goal, but sometimes it's difficult to estimate shipping costs accurately. I backed a project that seriously underestimated international shipping costs, so the creator had to secure a loan of $9,000 so she could fulfill all the rewards.

[Cbkimble]

So you are suggesting that all money collected as shipping fees never be shown to the public?

No, I wasn't saying that at all but why does it matter if Shipping is shown. Each pledge will pay XX amount for shipping. The only thing I'd like to make sure is shown, is a shipping price table so you see what rates are. Showing how much they recieved for shipping seems irrelevant to me.

[StanKindLee]

I actually enjoy being silly and provocative at times.

Anybody run into a project that is using the expanded shipping options? The whole funding goal/shipping relationship and how it is presented has already been established by KS.

[Sher]

Both Uusi Classic and Delirium are using the expanded shipping options.

[StanKindLee]

Both Uusi Classic and Delirium are using the expanded shipping options.

Well, as implemented by these two projects, there really is nothing new here to see. All of the expanded shipping selections are carrying the same price (it cost as much to ship to Canada as it does to Hong Kong). US backers still do not know how much of the pledge is going for shipping. The Delirium project creator has even said he would "prefer to keep the domestic price with shipping included" because it "looks more simple (and clear)".

As far as separating out shipping cost from the funding goal - good luck with that one. As simple as the concept might seem in thought experiments, actual implementation and reduction to working practice would not be simple at all - just think of the whole add-on item mechanism currently used.

[Mike Ratledge]

The thing is, neither project (Uusi Classic nor Delirium) used the new per country shipping ability. If it launched after it was announced, it shows up differently ("worldwide shipping available" or something similar).

The thing is that it looks like they did use that feature, but if you pop up the shipping prices you will see that it is the same for every country except the US. it has great potential, and allows for delivery from multiple fulfillment centers, as an example, but it is somewhat misleading - and wasn't intended to be - to make if show up like they used the ability to set shipping per country. I just hope they go to the multiple rewards ability - even if it's down the road. That one thing just does not work right for playing card projects. Think about Uusi Classic: you need three or four accounts if you want to get two or three special items, and most - if not all - are limited quantity available tiers so trying to add them on creates a nightmare as far as accounting for the campaign. It's just not practical unless it is a very simple project.

I am psyched! It is a good thing all around. The part about keeping shipping and handling out of the funding total is a tough one. It is just ingrained in us all that it does count, simply because it is the way we have been used to it working. If it's hidden, then it could be a problem, because - as others have pointed out - there's no way to tell if enough money was set aside for fulfillment. Many deck campaigns were screwed up by not knowing or setting concrete numbers to deliver the rewards. Just guessing, but I will go with 4 out of 5 or 80% of entries in the Hall of Shame ended up there from poor planning as opposed to intending to be fraudulent.

[StanKindLee]

The thing is, neither project (Uusi Classic nor Delirium) used the new per country shipping ability.

Got it... so there are no card project examples of the new shipping system in play yet then.

I am thinking a running a quick and dirty test campaign on KS (art related, but not playing card related), just to get a first hand read on how this changes things from a project creator's standpoint.

I just hope they go to the multiple rewards ability - even if it's down the road. That one thing just does not work right for playing card projects. Think about Uusi Classic: you need three or four accounts if you want to get two or three special items, and most - if not all - are limited quantity available tiers so trying to add them on creates a nightmare as far as accounting for the campaign. It's just not practical unless it is a very simple project.

KS has grown and mutated such that it is ready for crowd funding v2.0... has anyone seriously sent in the multiple reward ability to KS folks for consideration?

[albinodragon]

We've already built our next project with this and we can't wait. I'm sure some will be upset with how much shipping is, but it's not like that cost hasn't been there all along, it's just been hidden.

[Mike Ratledge]

The thing is, neither project (Uusi Classic nor Delirium) used the new per country shipping ability.

Got it... so there are no card project examples of the new shipping system in play yet then.

I am thinking a running a quick and dirty test campaign on KS (art related, but not playing card related), just to get a first hand read on how this changes things from a project creator's standpoint.

Well, I won't categorically deny that it's possible somebody has used that feature, but it's only been known to be available for a few days, now. Maybe somebody has? I just wish there was a way to know for certain, and right now there is not as far as you can tell. All projects launched starting a few days ago show up with that new wording about shipping locations, but I know for sure that does not mean the campaign author used that new per country shipping capability.

I just hope they go to the multiple rewards ability - even if it's down the road. That one thing just does not work right for playing card projects. Think about Uusi Classic: you need three or four accounts if you want to get two or three special items, and most - if not all - are limited quantity available tiers so trying to add them on creates a nightmare as far as accounting for the campaign. It's just not practical unless it is a very simple project.

KS has grown and mutated such that it is ready for crowd funding v2.0... has anyone seriously sent in the multiple reward ability to KS folks for consideration?

You would think someone had by now, since it's one of the most asked for features in our little world, but - again, I don't think it's even remotely possible that nobody has suggested it, but whether or not it's been taken seriously - that's another question.

The absolute optimum implementation would be to allow the campaign creator to turn it off if they don't want it for whatever reason, and to also allow multiples of each tier - and as long as we're shooting for the moon, maybe have a sliding scale for prices when the quantity selected goes up? Being an old school programmer, I know it's not something like trying to put a man on the moon. It would require a complete rewrite of the database schema used to track backer rewards, for certain - so it's definitely not trivial, either.

Coupling that with the realistic computing of shipping & handling by weight and number of pieces would be a perfect implementation. Again, I didn't say simple, it's definitely not. For playing card deck projects it pretty much falls into two categories: it's either # of decks, or it's "special handling" as we think of it for things like uncut sheets (or poker chip sets, for example). It's a given that for other project types it's not that easy, but for sure - it can be done.

[Sher]

The new system automatically detects my location and tacks on the international fee. I always have to switch it back to the US. I chose not to pay the extra fee because I know it costs the same to ship to Guam as it does domestically via USPS (you just have to make sure United States is the country and Guam is the "state" - sometimes Guam is designated as the country and that makes it international).

[Mike Ratledge]

The new system automatically detects my location and tacks on the international fee. I always have to switch it back to the US. I chose not to pay the extra fee because I know it costs the same to ship to Guam as it does domestically via USPS (you just have to make sure United States is the country and Guam is the "state" - sometimes Guam is designated as the country and that makes it international).

There are bound to be a few kinks to work out. Anything that has a 5-digit ZIP code is considered 'domestic'. Guam, Marshall Islands, US Virgin Islands, Puerto Rico - all those things and APO/FPO are all 'domestic'.