Disenchanted_11 wrote: ↑Wed Nov 22, 2023 10:16 pm
I am fascinated by the completionist backers, their support is incredible. What is not comforting at this point is that we depend on more of those pledges coming in (and getting retained) to reach the 500% marker.
I'm hoping when get to the end and 500% didn't happen, at least make the black borders a reality. Surely the consideration for that marker is mostly due to the added production cost of legacy editions. Some black inks wouldn't cost that much, right?
Call me a pessimist, but I'd rather be one right now and be wrong later; than be an optimist now and be wrong later.
I appreciate your participation in this thread Disenchanted... but I must say you have been a rather pessimistic voice, so to that end you are being successful at your goals! LOL.
I think 500% is likely at this point. I was caught by surprise by the demand for the loose Prism deck and I'm contemplating opening up 50 more (from my reserve of 70) to the add-ons. If those sell out we'd be looking at an additional 4.5k more or less. We still need to close the gap to 112.5k but we'd be close.
Regarding the black borders and their expense... let me try to be as illuminating as I can. So there are many factors that affect pricing when it comes to Cartamundi (or any printer for that matter). Edition size is the first obvious one. More decks = lower per unit cost. Inversely less decks is HIGH cost per unit. This is in part due to the set-up costs associated with a print run. Any 1 deck can have as many as 4 or 6 print cycles associated with it. You have to look at printing prices as a PER SIDE of the card thing. Each SIDE of the deck is a different price. The combined total is the price per deck cost of the print run.
For example the paper will go through the press once for CMYK printing, then again for Pantone or spot inks and a final time for Foil (not necessarily in that order--sometimes you want ink on the foil other times you want foil over ink). Those THREE Passes is PER SIDE of the card. 3 passes on the faces. 3 on the backs. Which is why decks with pantones and foils are more expensive than those without those features.
So as it stands right now the Black deck (which for all intents is the same as the Legacy) will SHARE the setup (and setup costs) associated with the Dynastinae and the Prism. That means that if I plan on printing 2500 black decks, 1500 legacy, 777 green decks, and 500 prisms that Cartamundi will set up and run DIFFERENT Cmyk, pantone and foil passes for the backs by default (3 passes each) and then the faces will ALL get the same CMYK, Pantone and Foils. So that means the 5277 black/gold/green/purple faces can all be printed at once--one setup for all PER feature (i.e. INk/pantone/foil). And because the edition size for the FACES is effectively 5277 it's much cheaper. What the stretch goals do is unlock specific changes to the faces of those decks. The prestige/legacy decks get black borders which now effective means that the dynastinae/prism faces are a NEW set up. And a new setup for a run of only 1277 decks (green and purple combined) means a MUCH higher price per unit. Compound that by the fact that if Prism gets the holofoiled faces that is now an ADDITIONAL setup with the Foil pass being different from Dynastinae to Prism with a very low run of 777 and 500 respectively. (The cymk and pantone setups would remain shared among the dynastinae/prism as they'd be the same still. Only the foil changes. The gilding on the legacy is no big deal because Cartamundi would just shave off the 1500 legacy decks and gild those leaving the remainder for the prestige. The tuck boxes are printed separately and are a marginal cost because the plates are shared. Requiring only new drums of foil for each pass (and then only on two of the three foil layers on the tuck--there's a shared gold layer both the black and gold tucks have). But the price per unit can be drastically affected by the cost of these setups and calibrations. Cartamundi isn't just changing the ink color or foil color theres a lengthy registration and calibaration process that takes place that assures foil lines up with the ink on the card perfectly, aside from adjusting plates or inks. SO a run of 50000 decks might only cost a few dollars a deck (which is how Theory 11 can price their decks so cheaply) and a run of 500 might be twenty times as expensive before even getting to gilding costs, tuck case pricing, fulfillment and any additional costs like the initial design itself.
So although I would LOVE nothing more than to add the black borders to the prestige and legacy decks, the stretch goals are strategically calculated to help pay for the additional costs involved in unlocking those very same features. They are not arbitrary markers. The $22,500 difference between 400 and 500 percent allows for the costs of running a new batch of gold tucks with new foils, gilding the prestige decks to become legacy, and adding the black borders to the prestige/legacy decks. Same goes for the prism upgrade. The magic bundle upgrade is a bit further away because now we are talking about Widakk's time to implement the marking system into the back design (which we've only just theoretically designed), the printing of said deck (another 2 set up pass for the backs) and tucks, the printing of the gaff pack cards and tucks, PLUS the design and printing of sleeves to hold both the deck and gaff pack together.
I hope this helps show why stretch goals are a thing and why features that seem obvious (like pantone inks, inner tuck box patterns or holo foil faces on the prism) are not so cut and dry. Just adding pantone inks is in effect adding an extra pass which doesn't double the price but perhaps adds 30-40%. CMYK after all is actually 4 passes IN and OF itself (Cyan, Magenta, Yellow and Black) which all need to be perfectly registered.
Evilgamer wrote: ↑Wed Nov 22, 2023 10:24 pm
500% will happen we only need $8700 in 15 days. That would be ludicrously low. Once we hit and unlock the gold deck that I don't really see too much defection from the higher tiers..some sure..but at this point with the prism decks sold out for all practical purposes the only way to get one is to go completionist/prototype so those tiers are becoming more on the asset than liability side of the ledger.
500% unlocks a new deck which will push us towards 600%. I think we CAN get there but my magic 8 ball is coming up fuzzy on the gold deck interest level. Past that point I dunno, unless Omar pivots and moves the marked deck lower there are only 2 rabbits that I know of that he can pull for significant funding.
1. uncut sheets, this probably happens but again...not sure the interest level
2. prototypes...which will cheese off some percentage of people in the absolute ultimate tier since that deck is currently locked to it, I'd buy one but I don't see Omar doing this.
The uncut sheets will be made available in the next few days. We usually sell a few. But not enough to move the needle to sizeably. The prototypes will never be offered for sale outside of prototype tiers. Only a small handful might trickle out as SPECIAL giveaways. I'm basically using all of the disposable units for the campaign.
My explanation above shows why moving the marked deck up is unlikely.
Ultimately what will get us to where we all want to go (600% and beyond) will be NEW backers. 540 is LOW even by my campaign standards. Part of this is my absence on Youtube. I have plans to release at least 2 if not 3 reviews during the last 15 days of the campaign that will hopefully garner new attention. Wyrmwood is also going to do another round of promotion for Beetlebacks that should bring in some new folks hopefully.
IF ANYONE has any ideas on how to spread the word I'm all ears. Happy to listen to them even if I've already thought of them and/or am doing them.
@playingcardophile
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