Horsemen - Kickstarter 1st June

[bdawg923]

Oh dang I just bought something from justplaycards.com, is the person you're speaking of also behind the webstore? I have send the store some emails for assistance but have yet to get a reply.

He is but I'm pretty sure that there are others who help with the store.

I don't get why those same people can't reach out to Tony or post a kickstarter update or reply to any emails about the kickstarter. I hope he's ok. I have written this project off as well.

[Timmargh]

I don't get why those same people can't reach out to Tony or post a kickstarter update or reply to any emails about the kickstarter. I hope he's ok. I have written this project off as well.

I wish I knew. At the beginning of the campaign he did tell me that he was going it alone.

[bdawg923]

Well things just got a bit shady. I was giving Tony the benefit of the doubt. Seemed to me he had a string of awful things happen like covid and a death in the family, hospitalization. He sent an update last March that said cartamundi confirmed a date with him.

But now a backer says that cartamundi claims they never even received the files from him. If true this is just bizarre. Why lie about even sending files to them.

I guess it is possible the backer is lying, or cartamundi is lying, or cartamundi is mistaken and did get the files, whatever. But at this point like 2 years into the campaign, it's starting to look like we got scammed.

[Adamthinks]

He did post pictures of the printed tucks in a March update, so this is confusing.

[Timmargh]

[...]

I guess it is possible the backer is lying, or cartamundi is lying, or cartamundi is mistaken and did get the files, whatever. But at this point like 2 years into the campaign, it's starting to look like we got scammed.

I really don't believe we've been scammed (he got prototype decks printed for one thing) but that is weird. But, would Cartamundi Give out info to someone not connected to the campaign? And as Adamthinks said, the mini tucks have been printed

[bdawg923]

[...]

I guess it is possible the backer is lying, or cartamundi is lying, or cartamundi is mistaken and did get the files, whatever. But at this point like 2 years into the campaign, it's starting to look like we got scammed.

I really don't believe we've been scammed (he got prototype decks printed for one thing) but that is weird. But, would Cartamundi Give out info to someone not connected to the campaign? And as Adamthinks said, the mini tucks have been printed

I guess it's possible he had every intention of making the deck originally. He posted pics of the tucks and also mini tucks in other updates. Maybe scammed was the wrong word to use. Stuff just doesn't add up. Either he's lying or cartamundi is lying or that backer is lying. I emailed cartamundi just now. Let's see if they reply.

[bdawg923]

Glad to see an update from Tony. Hopefully he is better soon.

[hsbc]

Who cares about cards compared with someone's health? Glad he's okay and hope he gets better - if/when I finally get these, that'll be a nice surprise

[hsbc]

Hi All,

Sorry I have been waiting for final dates for the reprint by Boschiero and the final print from Cartamundi. We can't do the prints until we confirm the mini cards will fit into the Boschiero template. Hopefully they will arrive soon.

Just a note we are still here

[Adamthinks]

[...]

I guess it is possible the backer is lying, or cartamundi is lying, or cartamundi is mistaken and did get the files, whatever. But at this point like 2 years into the campaign, it's starting to look like we got scammed.

I really don't believe we've been scammed (he got prototype decks printed for one thing) but that is weird. But, would Cartamundi Give out info to someone not connected to the campaign? And as Adamthinks said, the mini tucks have been printed

Timmargh, Any chance you can reach out to him again? It's been almost 3 months since he's last logged in to his Kickstarter account. Another commenter posted on the project page about 10 days ago, they also had reached out to Cartamundi and got a similar response that no money had ever been sent to them, nor image files and nothing has been printed. Not sure what the truth is, but this one certainly seems a lost cause at this point.

[Harvonsgard]

For what it's worth the last response I got was at March 6th. Since then, radio silence. Due to the circumstances and info I have/had I don't believe in a scam but in a Vanda like situation. I'm not sure if this will have a happy end like Stories though.

[Timmargh]

Timmargh, Any chance you can reach out to him again? It's been almost 3 months since he's last logged in to his Kickstarter account. Another commenter posted on the project page about 10 days ago, they also had reached out to Cartamundi and got a similar response that no money had ever been sent to them, nor image files and nothing has been printed. Not sure what the truth is, but this one certainly seems a lost cause at this point.

I've been trying, but, as with everyone else, I've had no response. As Harvonsgard said, I really don't believe this is a scam; he did tell me at the start that he is doing this entirely on his own so, assuming he's been incapacitated, there's no-one to take over.

Having known him for about five years (we started chatting regularly after our first deal) I really like the guy and am really worried. At this point I am unconcerned about the campaign and would rather just hear that he's okay. I understand that those who don't know him may think he's scamming us, but there's likely nothing anyone can do or say to persuade them otherwise. I will say, though, that he had prototypes made for each deck and I'm guessing that a scammer wouldn't bother spending money doing so: standard edition; collector's edition.

[hsbc]

This year has been awful for card designers, I just hope everyone turns out okay

[Adamthinks]

That's really unfortunate. Cards or no cards. I hope he's okay.

[bdawg923]

[Disenchanted_11]

That's awful.

This type of elaborate scam had been gaining popularity lately. Elements of fake progress, stretching things out, hospitalization, radio silence, unknown sources giving fake updates, reassurances. I kinda don't get the point why, why rub the salt into the wounds. If you're gonna do a scam, just take the money and go, people will learn and move on.

[GandalfPC]

Not sure its an elaborate scam, nor am I sure regarding health problems - sure its a mess with Vegas odds against delivery, but long odds are still odds.

[veil]

The latest unofficial update seems to conflict with the latest official update posted above, so it appears that someone has been untruthful, and I'm not sure why a backer of the project would lie about the information they got from Cartamundi. If Cartamundi has disowned the project, and never actually even started production, I would think that the odds of getting these decks are just about zero at this point unless we get another official update addressing this issue in the near future.

[KingfisherZero]

While it would in no way excuse the creator's actions...seems highly unprofessional for Cartamundi to answer random email questions about a customer's account/order status. That clearly seems like info that should only be shared with people directly tied to a project.

[Strag]

While it would in no way excuse the creator's actions...seems highly unprofessional for Cartamundi to answer random email questions about a customer's account/order status. That clearly seems like info that should only be shared with people directly tied to a project.

Not sure I agree. The backers themselves have "paid" for this project to be completed, and it's the creator themselves who have given the false information, making it seem as though Cartamuni is to blame. Why can the company not correct the misinformation that the creator gave?

[KingfisherZero]

I see what you mean...and ultimately I'm more than happy to keep the blame squarely where it belongs in the bigger picture.

But it seems like a slippery slope for companies to open up about transactions with parties that they don't contract with. Just seems like a privacy breach. Ironically, I would have felt a lot more comfortable had they put out a public statement explaining something rather than responding to a single random email.

[Timmargh]

I've commented on this too many times to repeat everything I've said, other than I don't believe it's a scam but a combination of health issues impeding progress, and one man trying to handle the campaign single-handedly.

[Strag]

I see what you mean...and ultimately I'm more than happy to keep the blame squarely where it belongs in the bigger picture.

But it seems like a slippery slope for companies to open up about transactions with parties that they don't contract with. Just seems like a privacy breach. Ironically, I would have felt a lot more comfortable had they put out a public statement explaining something rather than responding to a single random email.

The company I work for has exactly the policy of we don't volunteer information. However if someone says something that is factually incorrect about us, we are happy to speak to it publicly as well. My feeling is that is what's happened here.

[bdawg923]

I've commented on this too many times to repeat everything I've said, other than I don't believe it's a scam but a combination of health issues impeding progress, and one man trying to handle the campaign single-handedly.

I agree to an extent. I don't think he set out to scam anyone and things happened, then the situation spiraled. BUT, his latest update says "Cartamundi were paid, no scam." Yet now cartamundi is saying they never got paid. I was giving him the benefit of the doubt, but in this case cartamundi has no reason to lie. They're a reputable company with I don't know how many clients and successfully printed projects. Why is Tony lying in the latest update? Then he says contact the companies, they'll confirm what he's saying. And they're saying the opposite. It's just a weird situation. He brought someone in to help finish the project, but there hasn't been an update in months, and cartamundi apparently canceled the order. At this point I don't think there is anyone he brought in to help tbh. If he paid them in March like he said, cards should've been printed by now. Cartamundi would've said as much.

Having said all that, I've contacted them in the past and asked about the project, and got no reply. So I don't know for a fact this comment above is even real. Maybe the commenter is just annoyed and decided to make stuff up. Has anyone here contacted cartamundi or can someone here try? I trust the people here more than a random annoyed Kickstarter user. Here's the contact form https://www.cartamundi.com/us/en/contact/ in case anyone wants to try.

By the way in the comment cartamundi's reply says Horseman while the project is Horsemen (plural). Not sure if it's a typo by them or the user making stuff up.

[Timmargh]

I do have a prototype of each deck; I wonder if I could start a bidding war in the comments …

[GandalfPC]

Even in the case of cartamundi payment being a lie, it does not mean the lie was not told by someone ill, over his head and good intentioned to somehow recover (vanda variant)

[GandalfPC]

I do have a prototype of each deck; I wonder if I could start a bidding war in the comments …

For bidders unprepared, an educational video:

[bdawg923]

Now I think he's making it up and I caught him on the spelling error. So maybe cartamundi never replied and didn't divulge any info about the project to a random person.

Edit: he provided proof. Bad look for Tony

[Disenchanted_11]

IMG_0400.jpeg

Now I think he's making it up and I caught him on the spelling error. So maybe cartamundi never replied and didn't divulge any info about the project to a random person.

Like he said, the guy didn't owe you anything. What's funny in these types of scam is how the victims couldn't believe in it.

[bdawg923]

IMG_0400.jpeg

Now I think he's making it up and I caught him on the spelling error. So maybe cartamundi never replied and didn't divulge any info about the project to a random person.

Like he said, the guy didn't owe you anything. What's funny in these types of scam is how the victims couldn't believe in it.

He doesn't owe me anything, but either way, he did post the screenshots from cartamundi.