Army Men - Filing a report with the FBI - Internet Crimes

[GBAllison]

Pardon me for sticking my nose in here. This is a pretty unpleasant time--I get that--but I hope this post might help in some small way:

Oh and don't get me wrong, I'm not here to defend Adam (not one *iota*), but there *are* some useful tidbits hiding in his post. 1) For those of you worried that Adam is "lawyering up" or taking actions to defend himself in court, know this: No lawyer on the planet would have let him post that type of "this is entirely my fault" type of update. 2) He set a deadline on his refund request process, AND he made it clear it was first-come first-served, AND not everyone is gonna get a refund. You can hate it all you want, but if you really want your money back you should be at the post office right this minute sending in your SASE. It's not fair, and not the best process, and he might not do everything he said, but if he sends *any* refund checks voluntarily, you might want to be first on his list instead of last. 3) Maybe he won't actually do this. So you have to decide whether it's worth "investing" a couple of stamps to get into the "possible refund" line. Or whether you're just so flipped off ANGRY about this that you don't want to do *anything* this jerk suggests. Your choice. Either way, the ball is now in *your* court.

P.S. I like CrazyErnie's idea about AmericanExpress or other credit card enforcement mechanisms. That's crazy enough to actually work. Who knows whether the AmEx lawyers will bother to Track Him Down, but it's fun to imagine.

P.P.S. Option 3 is for a bunch of you to really try to invoke the U.S. Legal System. If you think that investing a couple of stamps is too much, just wait 'til you see how much of an investment it'll take to go the Legal System route.

P.P.P.S. Of course option 4 is to somehow convince Adam to do something different. I have no idea who he is, but it seems like he's pretty immune to communications and discourse.

P.P.P.P.S. However, if you take him at his word (yeah, I know, you're not exactly inclined to do that), perhaps he *can* be persuaded to do something for the International customers who can't pre-pay U.S. postage for their SASE. If there's *anything* I would expect him to budge on, that would seem more likely than others.

Like I said, I hope this helps. (Or maybe it's too soon.)

[elcyciB]

SASE is completely asinine...one would also think that he is offering this method, hoping most will not take him up on it being its so ridiculous but therefore exonerating himself, at least in his mind, because he is offering a refund

[Firthetic]

Pardon me for sticking my nose in here. This is a pretty unpleasant time--I get that--but I hope this post might help in some small way:

Oh and don't get me wrong, I'm not here to defend Adam (not one *iota*), but there *are* some useful tidbits hiding in his post. 1) For those of you worried that Adam is "lawyering up" or taking actions to defend himself in court, know this: No lawyer on the planet would have let him post that type of "this is entirely my fault" type of update. 2) He set a deadline on his refund request process, AND he made it clear it was first-come first-served, AND not everyone is gonna get a refund. You can hate it all you want, but if you really want your money back you should be at the post office right this minute sending in your SASE. It's not fair, and not the best process, and he might not do everything he said, but if he sends *any* refund checks voluntarily, you might want to be first on his list instead of last. 3) Maybe he won't actually do this. So you have to decide whether it's worth "investing" a couple of stamps to get into the "possible refund" line. Or whether you're just so flipped off ANGRY about this that you don't want to do *anything* this jerk suggests. Your choice. Either way, the ball is now in *your* court.

P.S. I like CrazyErnie's idea about AmericanExpress or other credit card enforcement mechanisms. That's crazy enough to actually work. Who knows whether the AmEx lawyers will bother to Track Him Down, but it's fun to imagine.

P.P.S. Option 3 is for a bunch of you to really try to invoke the U.S. Legal System. If you think that investing a couple of stamps is too much, just wait 'til you see how much of an investment it'll take to go the Legal System route.

P.P.P.S. Of course option 4 is to somehow convince Adam to do something different. I have no idea who he is, but it seems like he's pretty immune to communications and discourse.

P.P.P.P.S. However, if you take him at his word (yeah, I know, you're not exactly inclined to do that), perhaps he *can* be persuaded to do something for the International customers who can't pre-pay U.S. postage for their SASE. If there's *anything* I would expect him to budge on, that would seem more likely than others.

Like I said, I hope this helps. (Or maybe it's too soon.)

In the first place, the onus should not be on the backers to ask for refunds. Sending an SASE is patently ridiculous because

1) it’s 2013 and electronic payment technology has existed for years
2) for international backers, the cost is exorbitant
3) it is possible he will try to use the ‘your cheque was sent out weeks ago, I guess it got lost’ excuse
4) he should have or can ask for a list of backers’ details and email addresses, so he could send the cheques to us if he hates PayPal for some mysterious reason

I'm sure the refund system was deliberately set up this way so that it would deter a large number of backers from asking for their money back. Also, I find it hilarious that he’s setting a deadline on the refund requests, when he blew through his own deadline AND blew part of our money on paying back his loans. What a joke. To think that I was rooting for him to prove all the doubters wrong.

[Gareth]

First, give full transparency and full disclosure. Tell us what was the total money he received minus the KS and Amazon fees. Then tell us how much he spent on himself and let us know how much is left over that he has available immediately for refunds. Then give us a time frame as to how long it will take him to obtain the balance so that every last backer is issued a full refund.

+1. It's likely to trigger further incrimination, but will help to clear the air in the long run. (I presume the portion used to repay loans wasn't that large, but without this transparency it is easy to assume the worst).

Three things Adam needs to do;

1. As above, announce the figures as Sinjin suggested.
2. Ditch the SASE crap, get everyone's paypal account (or postal address for the few who don't have one)
3. Work out a reasonable order to repaying the money by paypal. (Given that some of the money availability is going to be sometime in the future...)
4. (Yeah, I know it was a three point plan). START REPAYING.

I guess there are two (easy) methods of working out the refund order;

• Pay the smallest backers first (advantage: gets the most people happier the quickest)
• Pay the bigger backers first (advantage: gets the biggest debts away first)

[minion1835]

I have filed a complaint with the FBI as this is a clear case of internet fraud, he took the money and paid off his & his wife's student loans, that is called "Misappropriation of Funds".


Penalties

Depending on how the crime is charged, the state in which you live, and the circumstances of the case, a misappropriation of funds conviction can lead to significant penalties. States allow for both felony and misdemeanor charges for theft, embezzlement, and misappropriation crimes. What separates a misdemeanor offense from a felony offense often depends on the value of the funds that were misappropriated, though state statutes may also specify certain types of misappropriations as felonies or misdemeanors. For example, public employees who take public funds are often punished more harshly than private citizens.

Prison. Misdemeanor misappropriation of funds convictions bring with them the possibility of up to one year in jail, while felony convictions come with sentences of at least a year or more in prison. Depending on the state, felony convictions can bring sentences of up to 10 years or more.
Fines. Fines with misappropriation convictions can be significant. Misdemeanor convictions typically have fines of $1,000 or less, while felony convictions can exceed $10,000.
Probation. Probation sentences are also possible with misappropriation convictions, though the possibility of probation depends on the circumstances surrounding the conviction and state laws. A person on probation has to comply with specific conditions, such as regularly meeting with a probation officer, asking the court permission to move out of state, and others. A person on probation who fails to meet the conditions can be sentenced to a jail or prison sentence. Probation sentences typically last at least a year, but can last 5 years or more.
Restitution. A person convicted of any type of theft, including misappropriation of funds, must typically pay restitution to the victim. Restitution is designed to pay the victim back for the money stolen, and is separate from any fines involved.

[jmrock]

@Minion... Kudos... I have compiled a list of people that have also been duped by Adam... Not as many people came forth as I would have hoped... I am unsure as to why so many people don't feel it necessary to stand up for themselves... I know I work hard for my money and can only imagine that being swindled for even one single dollar would be enough to want to recoup your funds... If you need further information regarding who has been taken advantage of, I would be glad to provide you that information after I receive the okay from those persons... Let me know... Thanks, J.

[dcell59]

If you paid by credit card you could do a fraud claim

Have you actually tried this? In the US, credit card companies put limits on fraud claims. You usually have 2-3 months to make the claim, and most projects have an estimated delivery time that is over 3 months after the money is charged to your credit card. I've talked to many Kickstarter project backers who have tried to do this, and they almost always fail because of this. People in Europe seem to be able to do this because of different laws.

[walrus]

I actually have done it, not with KS but with but with other fraudulent charges I have caught late. You are right, there is usually a thirty day period for a fraud claim but after that you can still dispute the claim through your credit card. You may not be able to file fraud but you can get your money back through your credit card. The further you get away from the original charge date the more murky the waters get. I can say I never got stuck with a fraudulent charge.