Moresque by LOTREK

[Decknowledgy]

Thanks to @Timmargh, I could get one.
Best case for anyone who's thinking shipping is a headache is to team up with someone from your own country, purchase in batches and spread the shipping cost among yourselves.

[Eric Lee]

Wow.... it's a hefty €12 to ship to UK while the deck is €17....
Probably gonna pass

*sad highland noise*

So basically $35 shipped for one deck. No foil on the cards. Probably questionable handling. Hard pass.

I get shipping is going to suck, we Americans are spoiled in that regard, but it's still over $20 per deck not factoring in shipping. I like the art (it's Lotrek, after all) but the value just isn't there for me, not at $35 for one deck. I can get 2 Kings Wild decks for less, and Jackson's decks will be foiled with great tucks. I can get an Eye of the Ocean deck for less than $35, and Lorenzo's decks will be foiled and gilded with an awesome tuck. At the quantities the Moresque's will be printed in, there isn't even an artificial rareness factor at play. I guess I'll just be happy with my Arabesque players edition decks, which were in fact actually affordable.

Lotrek has mentioned that the Moresque players ed will be available at resellers eventually. So just wait for a retailer who will carry this deck and get it from them at a lower (hopefully) shipping price.

[Strag]

Wow.... it's a hefty €12 to ship to UK while the deck is €17....
Probably gonna pass

*sad highland noise*

So basically $35 shipped for one deck. No foil on the cards. Probably questionable handling. Hard pass.

I get shipping is going to suck, we Americans are spoiled in that regard, but it's still over $20 per deck not factoring in shipping. I like the art (it's Lotrek, after all) but the value just isn't there for me, not at $35 for one deck. I can get 2 Kings Wild decks for less, and Jackson's decks will be foiled with great tucks. I can get an Eye of the Ocean deck for less than $35, and Lorenzo's decks will be foiled and gilded with an awesome tuck. At the quantities the Moresque's will be printed in, there isn't even an artificial rareness factor at play. I guess I'll just be happy with my Arabesque players edition decks, which were in fact actually affordable.

KWP shipping outside the US is nuts and look at all the tuck variants he does now. He's also redoing over and over again Federal decks and I have to say I am over that design. I do like some of his newer decks but the amount of variants (and fake Artist Proofs which are really just overruns that he sells at a higher markup) and I don't think that's the comparison you want to make. I haven't bought directly from KWP in well over a year and don't miss it at all. I have picked up some decks in the aftermarket from local sellers and I can get them for less than buying direct when factoring in shipping and VAT/Customs fees. Personally I am quite happy with Lotrek's decks and he pushes the boundries of design in ways that make his decks truely spectacular. Of course, choice is what makes the world go around so you are free to choose to buy or not.

[masagin303]

I can get 2 Kings Wild decks for less, and Jackson's decks will be foiled with great tucks.

And this my side of the story and you can add me praying I won't pay 19% VAT on top of it. Can we have at last one EU release without tears from overseas?

Screenshot_2021-05-18 Purchase Beowulf - Standard Edition.png (25.66 KiB) Viewed 11856 times

[Strag]

I can get 2 Kings Wild decks for less, and Jackson's decks will be foiled with great tucks.

And this my side of the story and you can add me praying I won't pay 19% VAT on top of it. Can we have at last one EU release without tears from overseas?

Exactly this! I can buy those same 2 decks with free shipping for £36 (Approx $51) from JP Games VAT included. No brainer for me for sure!

[bdawg923]

I can get 2 Kings Wild decks for less, and Jackson's decks will be foiled with great tucks.

And this my side of the story and you can add me praying I won't pay 19% VAT on top of it. Can we have at last one EU release without tears from overseas?


Screenshot_2021-05-18 Purchase Beowulf - Standard Edition.png

Are you telling me there are people who DONT live in America??

[portcullis]

I can get 2 Kings Wild decks for less, and Jackson's decks will be foiled with great tucks.

And this my side of the story and you can add me praying I won't pay 19% VAT on top of it. Can we have at last one EU release without tears from overseas?


Screenshot_2021-05-18 Purchase Beowulf - Standard Edition.png

Are you telling me there are people who DONT live in America??

Mod Magic request!!
https://tenor.com/view/who-rang-that-be ... f-15162298

[Harvonsgard]

Mod Magic request!!

No mod but

[sms69x]

I'm enjoying this.... For years we (Int'l buyers) paid for "free US shipping" on KS, and many of UC users were coming here defending KS creators as was not their fault, is just the way shipping works. So now stop just be coherent..
If you think the deck is expensive, then don't buy it...

we Americans are spoiled in that regard

You nailed it there.. Congrats

[istheis]

I do like some of his newer decks but the amount of variants (and fake Artist Proofs which are really just overruns that he sells at a higher markup) and I don't think that's the comparison you want to make. I haven't bought directly from KWP in well over a year and don't miss it at all.

Can you elaborate on the fake artist proof bit? This is the first I've heard that but would like to know the details if this has been confirmed. Is this common practice and just and ethical grey area? I've also been a little exhausted with KWP recently, between the block of wood, the founders edition (which was at the end of the day 5 different tuck boxes around a reprinted deck design) and the hand painted Scarlett decks.
All of them are sort of neat/interesting/valuable in their own way and ultimately, since there is a demand, I'm glad Jackson/KWP is able to profit off of their own work rather than resellers but I'm always shocked that people are willing to pay the upcharge for some of these things that to me feel sort of gimmicky.

[Lotrek]

Regarding shipping, I remember the first time I tried to buy Artisans from the T11 website. Shipping was more than the deck itself and my reaction back then was "WHAAAT? smurf off, I'm dropping it". Later of course I found out that the cost to send even a fart from the States to the world via postal service is indeed very high. Unfortunately, while Greece had one of the lowest rates before 2021, they now charge 11 euros to send a deck by registered mail. I add 1 euro for packaging material, handling etc. The good news is that this price is the same for 1 up to 3 decks and from 4 to 7 (I think) is another 4 euros so for more than 1 decks it gets more reasonable.

[Strag]

I do like some of his newer decks but the amount of variants (and fake Artist Proofs which are really just overruns that he sells at a higher markup) and I don't think that's the comparison you want to make. I haven't bought directly from KWP in well over a year and don't miss it at all.

Can you elaborate on the fake artist proof bit? This is the first I've heard that but would like to know the details if this has been confirmed. Is this common practice and just and ethical grey area? I've also been a little exhausted with KWP recently, between the block of wood, the founders edition (which was at the end of the day 5 different tuck boxes around a reprinted deck design) and the hand painted Scarlett decks.
All of them are sort of neat/interesting/valuable in their own way and ultimately, since there is a demand, I'm glad Jackson/KWP is able to profit off of their own work rather than resellers but I'm always shocked that people are willing to pay the upcharge for some of these things that to me feel sort of gimmicky.

I would consider a true Artists Proof to be decks that the artists as had done as a test run, typically from a short run printer like MPC. In reality I’m pretty sure that what Jackson does is simply use the overruns from his LE subs and just puts an “Artists Proof” sticker on them instead of the LE serial number. I mean there’s no strict definition of what an AP should be, but this doesn’t work for me. I actually have a couple of them and I cannot see any different between LE and AP aside from the sticker vs serial number.

Jackson has a big audience and a big business so cannot really blame him for getting what he can from the marketplace but I wouldn’t buy an AP again personally,

[Bikefanatic]

I'm debating getting a Player's edition since I'll have a Patreon edition.

[Harvonsgard]

I would consider a true Artists Proof to be decks that the artists as had done as a test run, typically from a short run printer like MPC. In reality I’m pretty sure that what Jackson does is simply use the overruns from his LE subs and just puts an “Artists Proof” sticker on them instead of the LE serial number. I mean there’s no strict definition of what an AP should be, but this doesn’t work for me. I actually have a couple of them and I cannot see any different between LE and AP aside from the sticker vs serial number.

Jackson has a big audience and a big business so cannot really blame him for getting what he can from the marketplace but I wouldn’t buy an AP again personally,

You're confusing prototype, soft proof and proof. And yes, there are definitions of those things in the print industry.
I personally would refrain from making accusitions when I don't have a clue about stuff and wouldn't throw mud at someone for no reason.
A proof is a sample of the actual print run therefore, you should see no difference between a proof and standard deck ...

[portcullis]

Mod Magic request!!

No mod but

Wait, I can put it in as an image link?? Why did nobody tell me!?! That's a [censored]-load easier for everyone.

[portcullis]

No foil on the cards. Probably questionable handling. Hard pass.

Do you hear that Lotrék? Do us all a favor and add a cheap plastic layer next time instead of using an expensive metallic ink. You know we collectors are all about the artificial and not about the substancial.

At the quantities the Moresque's will be printed ino, there isn't even an artificial rareness factor at play.

How dare you Lotrék to make decks affordable! Next time please less decks and trice the price again - or four times? I'm not educated on what rareness is worth nowadays . Please and thank you .

IKR, after a deck that came with a €3488 discount and a €17 deck, I'm starting to wonder what's happened to the real Lotrek and who is this impostor offering reasonably priced decks in his place.

[Bradius]

IKR, after a deck that came with a €3488 discount and a €17 deck, I'm starting to wonder what's happened to the real Lotrek and who is this impostor offering reasonably priced decks in his place.

Have no fear. I have a feeling Codex will come out in all it's foil glory with a price tag to match is magnificent splendor. Trumpets and horns will proclaim it's arrival and we shall all gather in the Hall of Athens with suitable tribute. Sadly, no Greek stamps will be included....

[redux]

What I find interesting is that when I add one Moresque deck (and nothing else) to the cart shipping is 12 €. When I add one Fable craft edition deck (and nothing else) the shipping rises to 27 €. Does this deck require so much more packing material or insured shipment or is it something else? Just out of curiosity...

[Lotrek]

What I find interesting is that when I add one Moresque deck (and nothing else) to the cart shipping is 12 €. When I add one Fable craft edition deck (and nothing else) the shipping rises to 27 €. Does this deck require so much more packing material or insured shipment or is it something else? Just out of curiosity...

It is something else and I will fix it later today. 2 decks should still be 12 euros.

[istheis]

A proof is a sample of the actual print run therefore, you should see no difference between a proof and standard deck

This clears things up quite a bit, high prices are one thing, deceit is another. Thanks for the brief explanation, now back to the Lotrek praise lol.

[Lotrek]

Shipping cost issue fixed! Now Fable Craft should not add to the shipping total...

[Timmargh]

[…] A proof is a sample of the actual print run therefore, you should see no difference between a proof and standard deck ...

That I did not know.

[Strag]

I would consider a true Artists Proof to be decks that the artists as had done as a test run, typically from a short run printer like MPC. In reality I’m pretty sure that what Jackson does is simply use the overruns from his LE subs and just puts an “Artists Proof” sticker on them instead of the LE serial number. I mean there’s no strict definition of what an AP should be, but this doesn’t work for me. I actually have a couple of them and I cannot see any different between LE and AP aside from the sticker vs serial number.

Jackson has a big audience and a big business so cannot really blame him for getting what he can from the marketplace but I wouldn’t buy an AP again personally,

You're confusing prototype, soft proof and proof. And yes, there are definitions of those things in the print industry.
I personally would refrain from making accusitions when I don't have a clue about stuff and wouldn't throw mud at someone for no reason.
A proof is a sample of the actual print run therefore, you should see no difference between a proof and standard deck ...

You are 100% right I did confuse proof with prototype, my bad. Even so...

I didn't make an "accusation" I stated an opinion which is grounded in the fact that I actually have 6 Artist Proofs along with the "regular" version and that aside from a label or sticker there is no difference between them that I can see.

Yes I know what a "proof" is in terms of printing. A soft proof is done in software (for example USPCC provides digital proofs prior to going to press to ensure that content and layout etc are correct) whilst a hard proof is a printed version but often in a different stage (such as it might include colour bars or be rough trimmed). When I used to do print runs for brochures (for example) I would get a proof sheet off the first run which would require my approval to proceed with the rest of the run. Often we would make tweaks based off that proof.

The word "proof" does what is says on the tin, it's there as a check of colours, process, what have you in order to ensure the final production run will be up to par and the expected design. Maybe I'm wrong and the AP decks are actually ones that Jackson is using to sign off before going to a full run. However IN MY OPINON I think it's unlikely.

Again, no slam against Jackson and he got around $250 from me for the 6 I own before I realised that being a KWP completionist was a fools errand

[Lotrek]

My understanding is that what we call “artist proof” cannot be a full deck. And if for some strange reason the proof is a complete deck, then there shouldn’t be more than 5 - 6 such decks available. Unless an artist needs to see 40 - 50 identical full decks to say “we’re printing”...

[BaconWise]

Regarding shipping, I remember the first time I tried to buy Artisans from the T11 website. Shipping was more than the deck itself and my reaction back then was "WHAAAT? smurf off, I'm dropping it". Later of course I found out that the cost to send even a fart from the States to the world via postal service is indeed very high. Unfortunately, while Greece had one of the lowest rates before 2021, they now charge 11 euros to send a deck by registered mail. I add 1 euro for packaging material, handling etc. The good news is that this price is the same for 1 up to 3 decks and from 4 to 7 (I think) is another 4 euros so for more than 1 decks it gets more reasonable.

1. Smurf Off may be my new favorite way to tell people off

2. Lotrek's humor is grossly underrated.

[joeblow]

Was this a pre-announcement of the Lotrek fart deck? Going to need a great seal on that tuck.

[rousselle]

Was this a pre-announcement of the Lotrek fart deck? Going to need a great seal on that tuck.

It's going to be an extremely limited edition. Only a phew will be made.

[Strag]

Will be be fully foiled??

[MagikFingerz]

Will be be fully foiled??

Not sure, but it'll definitely be air cushioned!

[Strag]

Will be be fully foiled??

Not sure, but it'll definitely be air cushioned!

I think you're just full of hot air