Kings Wild Project, Arthurian

[supernova]

I was eyeing a Camelot deck, but after I saw the video update I think I’ll hold out for Arthurian v2. The foil will make it look much better I think

When was anyone planning to give us a heads up that Arthurian gets a second edition?


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[RichK]

He's printing V2 with EPCC. (Watched his YouTube video on Draw Celtic knot.)

[JacksonRobinson]

New Holy Grail Edition of the Arthurian releases Saturday, October 3rd @ 12pm easter.

The decks will be $15. Here is the unboxing video to check out the new designs.

[vasta41]

New Holy Grail Edition of the Arthurian releases Saturday, October 3rd @ 12pm easter.

The decks will be $15. Here is the unboxing video to check out the new designs.

Seems like a pretty reasonable price, considering the foil as well. I'll probably be in for one. And I'm sure to have a very Kings Wild Christmas with all my delayed shipping decks coming then!

[Bradius]

Keep in mind that these are planned to be permanently available at KWP. So, my suggestion for those in the US is to pick them up when you can get an order over $50. But, yes, they look really nice for $15. I think that is what Jackson is looking to do by having a number of his favorite decks readily available for $15, many of which with foil and such. It is going to be hard to beat those decks at that price point. That said, if you are an eBay reseller, you might think twice about buying 10 and expect to flip them on eBay for a profit!

Why do I have in mind Fox going back and colorizing their B&W films when I see these foil versions of his older decks?

[JacksonRobinson]

Why do I have in mind Fox going back and colorizing their B&W films when I see these foil versions of his older decks?

Better just get ready lol!

[alric]

These look great, as do the Robin Hood deck. The foiling looks great, and it's both sides. The price tag is certainly really good for a well designed foiled deck, but I just can't get on board with the terrible handling. The Legal Tender deck is improving with each new print run in regards to the selective foiling, I just wish this Chinese printer could also produce a deck that can handle worth a damn. With the art and foiling as excellent as it is, Jackson doesn't even have to get it up to USPCC or Carta Mundi levels for handling, I might bite for MPC level handling. OK, maybe better than MPC, I would definitely be in with at least early Taiwanese EPCC.

[JacksonRobinson]

These look great, as do the Robin Hood deck. The foiling looks great, and it's both sides. The price tag is certainly really good for a well designed foiled deck, but I just can't get on board with the terrible handling. The Legal Tender deck is improving with each new print run in regards to the selective foiling, I just wish this Chinese printer could also produce a deck that can handle worth a damn. With the art and foiling as excellent as it is, Jackson doesn't even have to get it up to USPCC or Carta Mundi levels for handling, I might bite for MPC level handling. OK, maybe better than MPC, I would definitely be in with at least early Taiwanese EPCC.

If we don't make a bunch and keep experimenting with every aspect of card manufacturing you can be sure and expect the same results and no innovation. The newest run of Legal Tender decks are on par with USPCC and Cartamundi and neither one of them can manufacture foiling like this cold or hotpress, hands down. But as always there will always (not saying it's you those who don't like something even if the deck actually comes with butter on it.

[Mooseweasel]

"even if the deck actually comes with butter on it" Is that a secret KWP Butter Deck Confirmed? Would Edible playing cards be pushing the boundaries to far or is this the next King Wild Innovation? Cards So Goood you can Eat them! Not going to lie the way your knocking it out the park with some of these recent decks I would be tempted to put myself down for a Half brick breakfast

[Bradius]

I am not sure about edible cards, but Jackson does make some decent small batch coffee with a home built roaster. I think the website is kingswildcoffee.myshopify.com if you are interested.

[JacksonRobinson]

"even if the deck actually comes with butter on it" Is that a secret KWP Butter Deck Confirmed? Would Edible playing cards be pushing the boundaries to far or is this the next King Wild Innovation? Cards So Goood you can Eat them! Not going to lie the way your knocking it out the park with some of these recent decks I would be tempted to put myself down for a Half brick breakfast

Thank you for your kind words. We are really trying to get the recipe right for my new Classic Butter Finish. At first the cards are a little clumpy and greazzzy but with a little churning they really hit their stride a few days in.

[james001a]

Man does Jackson have a lot of things going on or what? And yet I never feel like he spreads himself thin because the work is still top notch. A talented man indeed. And quite a character to boot. He is a gift to the playing card community. And I am looking forward to the new Kings Wild Shorts Shorts series. They are actually shorts. However, I will be avoiding the Kings Wild Short Shorts series. They just would not work for me

[JacksonRobinson]

Man does Jackson have a lot of things going on or what? And yet I never feel like he spreads himself thin because the work is still top notch. A talented man indeed. And quite a character to boot. He is a gift to the playing card community. And I am looking forward to the new Kings Wild Shorts Shorts series. They are actually shorts. However, I will be avoiding the Kings Wild Short Shorts series. They just would not work for me

You really would be surprised at how flattering our new Kings Wild Speedos are on most all body types. Initial testing with various focus groups have shown that wearing them improve perceived card handling quality by 52%...

[RandyButterfield]

Hey Jackson,

I’m always extremely cautious when Bill or Lawrence want me to print anything with the China Expert / Legends printer (unless it’s necessary for timing for Parisian, or Holographic Foil with King of Tigers). If not for the necessary situation, I usually go with Taiwan.

But I have to say, what you guys are doing with the China printer is truly exceptional!! That Robin Hood Deck is badass and kickass!! And I only have the standard version.

I love that you guys are experimenting with and perfecting the 4CProcess + Foil print combo. I think it’s the best combo available for any designer!

This will always be a hobby job for me, but I’m glad that you’re excelling with Playing Cards as a full-time business! The subscription model is ingenious!

It’s too bad that we all won’t get to BS over drinks at 52 Joker this month.

Thanks, Randy

[JacksonRobinson]

Hey Jackson,

I’m always extremely cautious when Bill or Lawrence want me to print anything with the China Expert / Legends printer (unless it’s necessary for timing for Parisian, or Holographic Foil with King of Tigers). If not for the necessary situation, I usually go with Taiwan.

But I have to say, what you guys are doing with the China printer is truly exceptional!! That Robin Hood Deck is badass and kickass!! And I only have the standard version.

I love that you guys are experimenting with and perfecting the 4CProcess + Foil print combo. I think it’s the best combo available for any designer!

This will always be a hobby job for me, but I’m glad that you’re excelling with Playing Cards as a full-time business! The subscription model is ingenious!

It’s too bad that we all won’t get to BS over drinks at 52 Joker this month.

Thanks, Randy

Hey Randy,

I'm not worried at all when printing with the Chinese factory. They are by far the most responsive and easy to work with of all of the card manufacturers I've worked with. They have also proven the most dependable as well, and that includes USPCC and Cardimundi in the mix as well. (These statements are ALL made from my own experiences)

[GandalfTheWhite]

So happy today! I got 2 of Arthurian and 2 of Robin Hood!!!

[Ice_Panda]

unpopular opinion: I am on the fence with these. They look amazing! Love all the design aspects but the EPCC printing is really hard for me. I jumped on the Robin Hood deck and the New legal tenders and they were so cool the first day I played with them but after that they are never my first choice to pick up off the shelf. Just as a consumer, and only speaking for my experience, I think to myself is it worth picking this new deck up for me to play with for one day? But on the other hand I grabbed a few Table players V5 and gilded scarlet bicycles and those decks I cant put down! They are so so fun to play with. I hope some of the decks coming out the rest of this year will be different than EPCC.

[bdawg923]

unpopular opinion: I am on the fence with these. They look amazing! Love all the design aspects but the EPCC printing is really hard for me. I jumped on the Robin Hood deck and the New legal tenders and they were so cool the first day I played with them but after that they are never my first choice to pick up off the shelf. Just as a consumer, and only speaking for my experience, I think to myself is it worth picking this new deck up for me to play with for one day? But on the other hand I grabbed a few Table players V5 and gilded scarlet bicycles and those decks I cant put down! They are so so fun to play with. I hope some of the decks coming out the rest of this year will be different than EPCC.

I think winter solstice and Beowulf haunted 8s and deck the halls are epcc and if apple pi gets released that's uspcc. Not a good year for uspcc

[Ice_Panda]

I think winter solstice and Beowulf haunted 8s and deck the halls are epcc and if apple pi gets released that's uspcc. Not a good year for uspcc

Just to be clear as well. I know when you do something Jackson is doing where you deliver subscription decks each month and also adhoc decks that release throughout the year as well, you cant just print with one printer. It would take to long and you probably couldn't keep up. So I totally get it. I also understand certain printers can do things better Like Jackson said the gold foil with EPCC for the Robin Hood and new Arthurian deck works better with EPCC. Just speaking for myself what decks I open daily are the Table players and Scarlet's. I hope I am not coming off as an A hole

[sinjin7]

@Ice_Panda - I totally get where you're coming from. As a collector, I prefer decks that handle well and are playable, it's as important as the design for me. Classic example: I never pick up NPCC decks anymore. All lot of decks printed by them have awesome artwork, but they are so unpleasant to handle that I find myself putting aside never to use again after my initial disappointment with them. But just as we collectors have different priorities for what we want in a deck, designers have their different priorities. Jackson clearly prioritizes technical advancement and art over handling. This is not to say Jackson doesn't care at all about handling, but if given the choice between technical and artistic excellence versus excellence in finish and handling, he's going to go with the former, as evidenced by his use of the Chinese printer. All we can hope for is that either the Chinese printer improves it's handling, or the USPCC and or Carta Mundi make technical advancements in foiling on par with what the Chinese printer can achieve. I usually don't pick up decks from EPCC's Chinese printer anymore, but I got a few Arthurian and RH decks solely because the artwork is so good, but I suspect they're not going to be decks I use much.

[JacksonRobinson]

@Ice_Panda - I totally get where you're coming from. As a collector, I prefer decks that handle well and are playable, it's as important as the design for me. Classic example: I never pick up NPCC decks anymore. All lot of decks printed by them have awesome artwork, but they are so unpleasant to handle that I find myself putting aside never to use again after my initial disappointment with them. But just as we collectors have different priorities for what we want in a deck, designers have their different priorities. Jackson clearly prioritizes technical advancement and art over handling. This is not to say Jackson doesn't care at all about handling, but if given the choice between technical and artistic excellence versus excellence in finish and handling, he's going to go with the former, as evidenced by his use of the Chinese printer. All we can hope for is that either the Chinese printer improves it's handling, or the USPCC and or Carta Mundi make technical advancements in foiling on par with what the Chinese printer can achieve. I usually don't pick up decks from EPCC's Chinese printer anymore, but I got a few Arthurian and RH decks solely because the artwork is so good, but I suspect they're not going to be decks I use much.

It is a fun game to try and raise each part of design, art, and manufacturing up as we move forward as designers. Sinjin7 I feel very comfortable at where we are currently with the Chinese printer when it comes to the printing and foiling advancements. We are now actively advancing the handling and finish. If you purchased both the Robin Hood and Arthurian deck I encourage you to compare the two in terms of both "out of the box" handling and also later handling. You will find that the Arthurian deck has a much more pleasant "out of the box feel" we have changed nothing in the printing or finishing process only tweaked a few things post-printing and pre boxing. Once the Legal Tender V2s come out next month you will see those are even better. With each print run of every deck, we are able to raise each element of the overall production of the playing cards to the next level.

[sinjin7]

I think the Chinese printer is great in regards to the printing and foiling, I don't think that's ever been the issue. I've yet to have a satisfactory experience with any deck, handling-wise, from EPCC/LPCC China. I used to expect some degradation in handling with the use of foil, but with USPCC's Metalluxe and Carta Mundi's cold foiling, there's almost no drop off in handling. If you can get the Chinese printer to improve the finish to the point where the handling is as good as any deck from EPCC''s Taiwanese printer, then you'll really have a slam dunk, especially with the $15 price point you have for foiling on both sides of the cards and premium tuck case. Your standard decks are starting to exceed what most other designer put out as their premium versions. I'm just happy to see you're focusing on the handling as well. I look forward to the Arthurian and Robin Hood decks and especially the Legal Tender V2.

[Bradius]

I just received my Holy Grail Gilded Arthurian deck in today. A sweet deck I will tuck away. Never to be opened. Left in the cold and the dark....like a sword sheathed in stone.

[EndersGame]

So if you had an equal choice between the first and second edition, which would you pick and why?
- 2017 Arthurian 1st edition (Excalibur)
- 2020 Arthurian 2nd edition (Holy Grail)

Is the main difference that the 2nd edition has foil on the front/back of the cards, and would that make it the obvious one to pick?

BTW, I'm new to this thread, so I haven't followed the entire story behind the different editions. But I'm a huge fan of Jackson's decks based on classic literature, and as a collector I love the look of these.

[philmyer92]

If it's an equal choice I would say 1st edition since that's not as easily available compared to the 2nd which is still available on the website.

1st Edition handles much better if that's important to you. The artwork has been greatly improved for the 2nd edition, not just added foil, there are more embellishments on both number and face cards. There is also a new diptych joker. The font for the number has changed presumably so it's easier to read during games. The newer tuck box features a sword that tucks into the box which initially seems very cool and unique but unfortunately doesn't hold up too well over time.

[niktok]

Although i have the 2nd editon only , by far i would pick that if i had none and had the choice. And that's because as i liked collections from a young age ,my point of view is that collecting is mainly for the beauty and art of the items and not so much for the rarity . I always considered an ugly item (but very rare) in my collection to be just an investment . If there ever was one since i don't purchase it in the first place ...
The first edition would be nice if there wasn't any other .

So since the question was to pick just one ,definitely the 2nd edition

[wingedpotato]

If it is the "standard" v1, then I would pick v2. As said earlier, the embellishments in v2 are an improvement (the limited of v1 has those embellishments). Also, this is one of those times where the foil really does enhance the theme of the deck making it look more like a gilded illustrated manuscript.

[EndersGame]

I usually don't pick up decks from EPCC's Chinese printer anymore, but I got a few Arthurian and RH decks solely because the artwork is so good, but I suspect they're not going to be decks I use much.

Maybe I'm misunderstanding something here. But Arthurian v2 (Holy Grail) wasn't printed by EPCC's Chinese printer, was it? I understood that Jackson has been using a different printer (i.e. not EPCC) in China for those and many of this other decks.

In other words:
- 2017 Arthurian 1st edition (Excalibur) - printed by EPCC's Taiwan printer
- 2020 Arthurian 2nd edition (Holy Grail) - not printed by EPCC's Chinese printer, but by another manufacturer in China

It is true that around 2020-2021 EPCC and LPCC began printing in China (as I reported in my article A New Factory and a New Benchmark from LPCC and EPCC), and no longer exclusively in Taiwan as they had done up until then. But it's not EPCC's Chinese printer that Jackson has been using, but another manufacturer, whose name he hasn't disclosed publicly yet.

In the last few years a growing number of creators have been printing with Chinese manufacturers other than EPCC's partner. I've listed a number of them in this thread: Is the quality of decks coming out of China improving?.

[Adamthinks]

The 2nd edition was printed using EPCC's Taiwan printer. He has however done a reprint of the deck using the new printer in the past year, and that's what's being sold now. He has disclosed the name of that printer but I can't remember it's name. It's not one that anyone else uses though. I suppose you could call the reprint the 3rd edition, but it's identical to the 2nd in features and design. Though the stock and printing quality is a bit different.

[zuccha]

This has been on my mind as well. I thought I could review the v2 I purchased because it was on sale at a discount in the SoCal and I received it just today, but the v2 is the EPCC version.... I guess the unmarked was the new Chinese version, I should have checked before buying. (I bought it thinking that v2 was the re-released one and the unmarked one was made by the previous EPCC. But I like this deck so I don't regret having two)

The EPCC version is thicker and stiffer, quite unwieldy for me as I like B9 slimline. The warping of the card due to the foil is also frustrating.
Is the Chinese printer that KWP uses TONGHENG like THE LORD OF THE RINGS? Though the evaluation of paper quality is highly subjective,
Compared to MISTBORN and BEOWULF V2(fanning it out would be 3 or 4 blocks), LEGAL TENDER BRITISH STERLING and onward have been much better, so I was hoping ARTHURIAN would be closer to the latter.

ARTHURIAN(EPCC) 52 sheets thickness 107.61mm, weight 17.85g

BEOWULF V2 91.87mm, 16.09g
LEGAL TENDER BRITISH STERLING 88.63mm, 16.45g
THE LORD OF THE RINGS: THE TWO TOWERS (FOILED) 87.15mm, 15.82g

The mysterious RPC (TONGHENG?) piece has a large burr in the modern cut direction. It is difficult to faro shuffle them in either direction....