Marvelous Decks - Hummingbird Feathers

[BaconWise]

There's a new deck and a new company coming in September. Not much to go on, but keep your eyes peeled and you can sign up on their website for a notification. They also have an IG profile @marvelousdecks

http://marvelousdecks.com/

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[Fud]

This is one deck that I was really interested in. They are clearly putting a lot of stock in the pre-launch hype, but when it finally drops:

- 3 decks
- Standard recolored faces (from the 1 photo) with holo foil
- No clear photo of the back
- $25 per deck

Shipping in the US for 3 decks is $16, plus $5.1 "SC" fee. So $90 for 3 decks?

And no way to contact the creators?

And no timeline on when it will be printed

And no mention of printer?

I feel like there is an unspoken rule about creators speaking negatively about other creators, but this is pretty gutsy from a new player. I know how much these decks cost to print, and they seem to be trying to grab a big slice of pie here. They haven't provided nearly enough photos to justify the cost, and having a pre sell on a website with 3 images doesn't scream 'confidence.'

Also, I wonder if the Diffractor guys have seen this, as they have a patent of holo foil on card faces...?

Am I missing something here?


***EDIT***

After a brief discussion with the creator via IG (still no email or contact link on the website (?!)) I have some more clarity on the project. But am I wrong in expecting a prelaunch to include at least basic information?

[kellarswonders]

Thank you for your comments. However, confidence in this project as there has been much work with this deck. Marvelous Decks is a series that was started by Kellar O’Neil who has just completed and fulfilling soon Charmers Playing Cards with Lotrek. I am a member of 52PlusJoker and has much support from the community. These decks will be printed by Cartamundi on Slimline B9 finish. The backs and faces use both holographic foils with inks. There are three different colors of cards and tucks. The tucks will be masterfully letterpress printed by Fresh Impression. The sets are limited signed and numbered. We would appreciate that before you start posting negative posts that you might focus on the positive here. Thank you for your time.

[sjrosenfield]

Let me definitely say that VXD didn’t patent holo foil on faces. You can check with them. Holo foiling on faces isn’t new and other designers have done it before. They do use a transparent holo fouling which maybe they created (which they can patent). But I assure you, this is not the same technology as VXD.

[Fud]

We would appreciate that before you start posting negative posts that you might focus on the positive here. Thank you for your time.

Positivity is all well and good, but still:

- delivery date?
- point of contact?
- limited? To what?
- any more photos than the 3 provided?
- shipping, returns/refunds policy?

But I assure you, this is not the same technology as VXD.

Good, it wasn't clear.

[PiazzaDelivery]

We would appreciate that before you start posting negative posts that you might focus on the positive here. Thank you for your time.

Positivity is all well and good, but still:

- delivery date?
- point of contact?
- limited? To what?
- any more photos than the 3 provided?
- shipping, returns/refunds policy?

But I assure you, this is not the same technology as VXD.

Good, it wasn't clear.

Yeah, I would also like a little more information before grabbing some. And DEFINITELY more pictures.

[sjrosenfield]

Hey fud,

Delivery date is on the site

Contact form is avail on the site

Quantity is all up there as well

There is no photos other than renders. Nobody prints prototypes of holo foiled decks, nor any foil decks for that matter.
What question in shipping do you have?

Returns or refund policy would be a good edition.

The site is new, so there are going to be hiccups. So be a little patient.

Also are you planning to buy any or are you just trying to make this amazing release look bad?

[supernova]

Thank you for your comments. However, confidence in this project as there has been much work with this deck. Marvelous Decks is a series that was started by Kellar O’Neil who has just completed and fulfilling soon Charmers Playing Cards with Lotrek. I am a member of 52PlusJoker and has much support from the community. These decks will be printed by Cartamundi on Slimline B9 finish. The backs and faces use both holographic foils with inks. There are three different colors of cards and tucks. The tucks will be masterfully letterpress printed by Fresh Impression. The sets are limited signed and numbered. We would appreciate that before you start posting negative posts that you might focus on the positive here. Thank you for your time.

I appreciate that double sided holo cold foil on Cartamundi isn’t cheap, which is probably why the price point is higher. That said, I would like more info than what is currently provided before I jump in.

- What’s the difference between the red, blue and purple decks? Clearly the tuck cases are different. How about the cards? Is it just the card back or also the card faces?

- There’s no clear pictures of the card back to date. I appreciate that it may not be ready. But some details would be helpful. Are they full bleed card backs or are there borders? Design wise, is it an iteration of the tuck case? You said holo foil, but holo foil is usually just one foil but looks different as the light hits it differently. Are there inks over printed on the holo foil so it carries a different colour, ie similar to Montenzi’s no 7 deck?

- Gilded decks - they can only be purchased in 3s? Can I ask who is doing the gilding? I understand from Montenzi that Cartamundi only offers gold, silver and holo gilding services with their French gilder.

[Fud]

Delivery date is on the site
Contact form is avail on the site
Quantity is all up there as well

What question in shipping do you have?

Returns or refund policy would be a good edition.

The site is new, so there are going to be hiccups. So be a little patient.

Also are you planning to buy any or are you just trying to make this amazing release look bad?

Fantastic, though I would have expected basic info like that to be up at the point you ask for money. Doesn't really matter how new it is, if you are taking payments you should have minimum info.

Shipping info like duration, tracking, carrier, Covid plan - a few things to cover.

As I said at the start, I liked the decks and wanted to get them. But from a customer perspective (which is the only position that matters here) the amazing release really hit a wall for me when it was missing so much.

I'm not trying to mess your release up, but you've got to admit - there was a lot of important info missing when you opened the doors, much (but not all) of which has since been added.

[sjrosenfield]

Supernova all that info is on the site under the description.

And fud, if you’re not comfortable buying from the site seeing what’s on there now, then you probably shouldn’t buy it.

If you have any further questions, why not email the site. Why come here and ask these questions?

It has way more info than most sites do.

It’s also not my release just a voice of reason

[BaconWise]

I see Kellar as a valued member of not only the magic community, but of the collector community as well. He has shown an incredible amount of kindness and positivity ever since I began following him on Instagram.

While I appreciate there is data missing, I think we should consider showing Kellar a great deal of support, whether it be purchasing some decks or simply encouraging him on this journey. He has been a huge voice of encouragement, not only for me, but for many creators in the community. Also, it's not his first project, as Charmers will soon land in the hands of his many backers. He understands quality and he's providing something we haven't seen before under the shroud of mystery he lives by ("Keep the Wonder"). I encourage anyone here to take the time to reach out and talk to Kellar about this project and you will see the passion he has and his desire to provide something unique and top-shelf.

I'm not sure I understand the criticism on the first day of launch. Yes, the price is high and the site is missing a lot of technical details, but let the customer base decide if they want to support the project, rather than casting a shadow on a new adventure. The concerns are all valid, but the decision to air it out, right out of the gate, seems a bit insensitive.

[sjrosenfield]

I see Kellar as a valued member of not only the magic community, but of the collector community as well. He has shown an incredible amount of kindness and positivity ever since I began following him on Instagram.

While I appreciate there is data missing, I think we should consider showing Kellar a great deal of support, whether it be purchasing some decks or simply encouraging him on this journey. He has been a huge voice of encouragement, not only for me, but for many creators in the community. Also, it's not his first project, as Charmers will soon land in the hands of his many backers. He understands quality and he's providing something we haven't seen before under the shroud of mystery he lives by ("Keep the Wonder"). I encourage anyone here to take the time to reach out and talk to Kellar about this project and you will see the passion he has and his desire to provide something unique and top-shelf.

I'm not sure I understand the criticism on the first day of launch. Yes, the price is high and the site is missing a lot of technical details, but let the customer base decide if they want to support the project, rather than casting a shadow on a new adventure. The concerns are all valid, but the decision to air it out, right out of the gate, seems a bit insensitive.

Well said Bacon, and although there was a bit of info missing at the time of launch, all that info is added and should be more than enough info for those interested. If anyone has further questions, definitely reach out to them and I’m sure your answers will be answered.

[kellarswonders]

@supernova. Thanks for your questions and positive support.

What’s the difference between the red, blue and purple decks? Clearly the tuck cases are different. How about the cards? Is it just the card back or also the card faces?

The cards will be printed to correspond to the tuck cases. So there are 3 different colored backs and fronts will correspond with the tucks.

- There’s no clear pictures of the card back to date. I appreciate that it may not be ready. But some details would be helpful. Are they full bleed card backs or are there borders? Design wise, is it an iteration of the tuck case? You said holo foil, but holo foil is usually just one foil but looks different as the light hits it differently. Are there inks over printed on the holo foil so it carries a different colour, ie similar to Montenzi’s no 7 deck?

The card backs are full bleed (borderless). Yes the backs are similar to the tuck case design. There are pictures of the backs that we will get on the site as well. These decks will be using rainbow holo foil with inks to create this beautiful colorization.

- Gilded decks - they can only be purchased in 3s? Can I ask who is doing the gilding? I understand from Montenzi that Cartamundi only offers gold, silver and holo gilding services with their French gilder.

Yes, gilded decks only in sets. Gilding will be done by Otto in the US for corresponding gilding.

[sjrosenfield]

For those that don’t know who Otto is, he’s the company that does uspcc and most all the other amazing gilding in the USA. I believe Jackson uses him also but I could be mistaken.

[supernova]

@supernova. Thanks for your questions and positive support.

What’s the difference between the red, blue and purple decks? Clearly the tuck cases are different. How about the cards? Is it just the card back or also the card faces?

The cards will be printed to correspond to the tuck cases. So there are 3 different colored backs and fronts will correspond with the tucks.

- There’s no clear pictures of the card back to date. I appreciate that it may not be ready. But some details would be helpful. Are they full bleed card backs or are there borders? Design wise, is it an iteration of the tuck case? You said holo foil, but holo foil is usually just one foil but looks different as the light hits it differently. Are there inks over printed on the holo foil so it carries a different colour, ie similar to Montenzi’s no 7 deck?

The card backs are full bleed (borderless). Yes the backs are similar to the tuck case design. There are pictures of the backs that we will get on the site as well. These decks will be using rainbow holo foil with inks to create this beautiful colorization.

- Gilded decks - they can only be purchased in 3s? Can I ask who is doing the gilding? I understand from Montenzi that Cartamundi only offers gold, silver and holo gilding services with their French gilder.

Yes, gilded decks only in sets. Gilding will be done by Otto in the US for corresponding gilding.

Thanks for the info. This is much more reassuring. Let me mull over it a bit

[shermjack]

BTW, the "SC fee" is South Carolina state tax and only applies if you have your decks shipped to South Carolina. I ordered a few decks (a brick in total) and my shipping was only 8USD to TX and no SC sales tax.

I very much look forward to receiving these decks! Thanks, Kellar!

[Fes]

If you have any further questions, why not email the site. Why come here and ask these questions?

This is a forum for discussion and a great place to ask questions. Those questions, these questions, any questions relating to this deck. That includes the launch site. I think that's what this thread is for.

Looks like those questions asked were a great learning experience by the way. The intro page on the site is a bit on the lacking side of information. Have to goin to shop to get some details. This thread has a lot of information in it though.

[BaconWise]

Great point, @Fes. UC is a great place for all discussion and a great place to learn.

I'm glad the questions and concerns were shared, but the BUYER BEWARE, alarmist approach was misguided. UC should be (but isn't always) a forum for constructive criticism and I think the earlier comments go beyond that into what seems to be puzzling negativity for another creator. That may not be the intention, but it reads that way from the outside.

That being said, there were excellent perspectives brought forward and Kellar has had a great response to his project so far. I'm eager to see these unique and beautiful creations.

[Harvonsgard]

What I read from the outside is that a guy not related to the creator/project shared his perspective and asked questions about a playing card project on a playing card forum. Then people who are to certain degrees related to the creator/project are responding and accusing Fud for negativity... Looks more like bias and not voice of reason.

Anyhow, if a deck has nothing to offer than a technical feature (holo humming bird bling bling) I'm out anyways. Plus "mystery marketing" that was cool when Lost aired for the first time... ...

[sms69x]

What I read from the outside is that a guy not related to the creator/project shared his perspective and asked questions about a playing card project on a playing card forum. Then people who are to certain degrees related to the creator/project are responding and accusing Fud for negativity... Looks more like bias and not voice of reason.

Exactly!

All points that Fud raised are valid and we all know that they can make the difference between we getting what we paid for or not.. So this comment is totally unnecessary...

We would appreciate that before you start posting negative posts that you might focus on the positive here.

If the creator can't see that in asking those quetions and getting some valid answers he is actually helping him, then... I don't know what that says about the creator... Will have to wait and see..

[Fud]

I'm not going to respond to all the points made by the project team (I never wanted to pick a fight), but I want to be clear that I was asking those questions as a CUSTOMER, not a creator.

I legitimately want to see these decks made - I like them. I wish the creator all the best in the launch. I purchased in the first 30 mins regardless of my concerns. So it is as a customer that I asked questions.

As a customer, I didn't see a lot of information that I would expect to see.

As a customer, when I contacted the creator on IG (the only way to contact at the time), I was told (quote): "Why are you giving such a difficult time here?... Please be kind to your fellow creators." That ticked me off.

Then on here I get told that I'm being difficult, deliberately trying to ruin a launch, and not being positive.

At this point, I'm still a customer. I already purchased the decks. I'm not trying to undermine anyone. But I'm annoyed.

I haven't looked at the website recently, but is there any inventory mechanism to count purchases of these 'limited' decks? Is there shipping and refund policy up there yet? How long is this prelaunch anyway? Who is fulfilling them? Will I get a tracking notification when shipped? I didn't get a post purchase confirmation email with any sort of next steps or info, just a reciept. How do I know what to expect?

I was told that I shouldn't bother purchasing if I needed more info, because the website has "way more info than most sites do". It probably does, but not more info than any successful ecommerce site I've ever seen...

Again, I like these decks and I'm not trying to drag anyone down. But being slammed by people affiliated with the project, and being told to "be positive" by the creator is very telling about the attitude to a business of this team.

I didn't want a big argument, but I think these are valid concerns and it is the correct forum for voicing them (especially when there was no email contact at the start and I was brushed aside on IG PM).

If you think I am overreacting as a customer, I will happily retract anything I said when proven wrong. But instead of getting defensive, maybe consider that I'm actually trying to help?

[rousselle]

So, just a personal opinion here, but I didn't find Fud's questions to be in any way aggressive, and I was asking myself the same questions. As it is, I do sincerely look forward to receiving my Charmers first, and then I'll take another look at these decks afterward. No offense intended to anyone; this is just my policy. When it comes to new creators/companies, I prefer to have my first order delivered / first rewards fulfilled before I buy/back for a second. Again, this is not intended as a swipe at anybody, and I really am excited to get those Charmers in my hands.

Once I have my Charmers (FWIW, I did back for all the different color variations), I'll have a better idea of how the reality meets the hype. My expectations are pretty high, and I'm optimistic that they'll be met. The photos I've seen certainly suggest as much. But, the proof is in the cards.

I don't see any reason to be defensive about the questions Fud posed, and I am happy to at least see those questions being taken seriously and being answered here. Kellar, you are keeping fine company and you are clearly aiming high. You've been around UC enough, I think, to know that several of us here like to ask the relevant questions. If someone points out their concerns, it's not an attack; it's an opportunity.

Goodness knows I've asked Ben the tough questions on more than a few occasions, and he's always been happy to answer in an open and friendly manner. That's one of many reasons why I always purchase with confidence when I buy his decks.

[MagikFingerz]

We would appreciate that before you start posting negative posts that you might focus on the positive here.

Also are you planning to buy any or are you just trying to make this amazing release look bad?

And fud, if you’re not comfortable buying from the site seeing what’s on there now, then you probably shouldn’t buy it.

We've seen a lot of deck designers, creators, and project managers come through here over the years. We've seen many different types of personalities, and I instantly recognized the above quotes as the kind of responses made by some of the more negative ones (deck designers unable to take criticism comes to mind). It's not a good way to build customer relations or inspire trust. People pick up on these things, if not consciously then subconsciously. And it's fitting that it's Ben (Fud) receiving these responses, because you can probably go into any of the threads for his projects to see good examples of how to respond to critical questions and feedback.

My advice: Get a public relations person to respond to people on forums, social media etc. Because what's happening here isn't working for you.

[bdawg923]

I was wondering about whether some users are associated with the brand / deck / company and don't immediately make it obvious. Some of the comments in this post read as though they're from an employee of the company. Shouldn't users associated with the company be labeled as such? Maybe with a different color username like creators get. It seems disingenuous to me.

Regarding the cards, the back design looks nice. Not a fan of the faces at all. And I appreciate Fud asking all the questions that should have been answered on the site from day 1. I also had these questions about a new release from a creator I haven't seen before. It doesn't behoove the creator and his employee? investor? or whoever to get so defensive about simple questions. Nobody is trying to spoil your release by asking basic stuff about a deck they'd be spending $25 for.

[Harvonsgard]

Shouldn't users associated with the company be labeled as such? Maybe with a different color username like creators get. It seems disingenuous to me.

What's an associate though? Someone that knows the creator through social media and chats occasionally with him?

[bdawg923]

Shouldn't users associated with the company be labeled as such? Maybe with a different color username like creators get. It seems disingenuous to me.

What's an associate though? Someone that knows the creator through social media and chats occasionally with him?

I wouldn't consider that as being associated with the company. I was thinking more like a someone who advised on the project, maybe a producer of the deck, consultant, designer (edit: website or deck or tuck designer). Associated as in directly, not a fan on Instagram.

[Fud]

So, its been a few weeks since the launch, and not a single piece of communication to buyers on progress.

Has the 'funding' period ended? What's happening?

[kasuma99]

All of the details scream a nice to have deck to me as i especially love shiny decks and further more: Cartamundi Stock with borderless card backs.
Still, being careful with my money, i will take the loss of buying them for some premium on the 2nd market instead of giving cash out right now.

[Fes]

Interestingly enough last week I had the notion to order some of this. I went to the site and it was the same as before, no new information, images nor developments posted. I decided then (again) that I would also be patient. I'm glad I did too, since it looks like this month is shaping up to be one of those costly months for playing cards anyway. My wallet is already feeling the squeeze and the months barely half done.

[GandalfTheWhite]

Talking about wallets taking the squeeze. Same here and more squeeze coming in for the KWP threads.