Ace Fulton's Casino, Femme Fatale

[Azid]

Art of Play just released these Ace Fulton's Casino, Femme Fatale:
https://www.artofplay.com/products/ace- ... -fatale-ed" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[RichK]

Stop please. (Not you Azid)

[Adonael]

Associating a colour with a gender, ugh. You know what colour actually does have something at all to do with the character archetype of 'femme fatale'? Red.

[Justin O.]

I agree with Adonael, red is definitely the color I associate with femme fatales. And whether you agree with the social gender politics happening in society right now or not, color-gender stereotyping seems like a misstep for AoP

[Harvonsgard]

Oh boi, it is just a silly name for a deck of cards. No need to call the police on Brad.

[Adonael]

Dismissing things with 'it is just' is how so many damaging issues and dumb things in the world are ignored and perpetuated. It might seem insignificant, but somebody needs to call it out when they can, otherwise nobody will and nothing will change. Plus it's honestly just a bad choice considering the phrase is associated with red.

[ThatGuyDave77]

I understand both sides of the argument. However, the names Brad chose, for his last couple of decks, seem to be influenced by his passion of classic films, as is the vintage noir style of his photography. I mean, the dude does have a film degree. I’m sure it has nothing to do with gender norms. Hell, pink is his favorite color. If you grew up in the 80’s, pastels, checkerboards, and especially pink, were worn by almost every “boy” in SoCal. Especially if you were part of the surf/skate culture. Google images of “80’s town and country” to see what we wore, if you’d like. Pink was everywhere and I never thought twice about it being gender specific, until companies began marketing it that way. I also understand why some younger people may be put off by the use of pink instead of red for a femme fatale. However, if you google 80’s femme fatale images, you will clearly see the use of just as much pink as red. IMHO, I viewed the color choice as a simple “role reversal” to the previous “Pretty in Pink”. Nothing more. But, as I stated already, I’m an 80’s kid and we weren’t raised with this type of knee jerk reaction to gender issues. Or a World Wide Web of -/+ feedback loops, trolls, and white knights. Ahhh, the good old days haha. Can we just enjoy the deck if we want, or not, and leave the controversial rhetoric and negativity out of it? It’s not like the name is anywhere on/in the deck. It’s, in my opinion, a colloquial name he gave it based on vintage films.

[Adonael]

If you grew up in the 80’s

Pink has obviously never been exclusive to one gender in clothing, but it is still almost exclusively associated with and used for items marketed toward females.

until companies began marketing it that way

They began marketing it that way in the 40's, opposite to established ideas in fact as pink was considered masculine throughout history up until then, it's not a new issue.

we weren’t raised with this type of knee jerk reaction to gender issues

The youth and young adults today are fighting against the toxic norms perpetuated by the previous generations, so I doubt their parents taught them to do that. They're just using their heads. Besides, I didn't see any knee-jerk reaction here, just a quick mention, which wasn't even the main point of the comment. It may not have been intentional, but that's kind of the point, when it's ingrained in you by culture, society and marketing from the beginning you don't think about it, which is why it's a problem.

leave the controversial rhetoric and negativity out of it?

You are certainly free to do so, considering you are the only one bringing any. There's nothing controversial about this to anyone of reason, and addressing it is only done with positivity in mind as it can only bring about positive change.

[ThatGuyDave77]

Wow. Looks like I hit a nerve there. Sorry if I ruffled your feathers. I was only intending to give a little background on why the name was chosen and why he went with pink instead of red. I know the colors were targeted at specific genders by clothing manufacturers around the 1940’s. However, I also know it wasn’t a switch that got flipped and made everyone see it that way instantly. I can’t speak to every region, but I do know a few parts of the country, California definitely being one from personal experience, didn’t bend the knee until the late 80’s. I was trying to help clarify a situation, it seemed, at least a couple of people took issue with. If you think anything I said in my previous comment was negative, you really should consider lightening up a bit. Not one sentence was typed with negative intent. Only to inform. The deck has been out for 24 hours and there’s a post commenting on the pink choice and replies about the gender issue. That, imo anyway, is what some refer to as a knee jerk reaction. In other words, quick to comment before finding facts. But you're entitled to your opinion as well, and I respect it. I have no problem agreeing to disagree if you still feel I had malicious intent in my previous comment or this one.

[Harvonsgard]

Just gimme a call when we are back at playing cards and/or real world issues that really should be addressed. Thanks in advance.

[Adonael]

Looks like I hit a nerve there.

I don't see where you got that idea, just politely addressing what you've said because I saw flaws in it.

If you think anything I said in my previous comment was negative, you really should consider lightening up a bit.

Again, I seem to be the only one who is lightened up out of the two of us because I clearly only have positive intent. So for you to imply any negativity on my part in your previous comment, what did that say about yours in comparison which included a lot of negative language? That's why it seems you're the only one bringing any, even if you don't intend to.

That, imo anyway, is what some refer to as a knee jerk reaction.

And those people would be wrong. The time when somebody happens to see something is chance and nothing more, could be sooner or later, either way is irrelevant.

Just gimme a call when we are back at playing cards and/or real world issues that really should be addressed. Thanks in advance.

That is exactly what we are addressing, and I feel sorry for you and your small perspective if you can't see why, it's just a small piece of a bigger much more important picture. You've already made it quite clear in another thread that you don't give two shits about 'real world issues that really should be addressed'. At this point I hate to imagine what you do think is important, clearly not our species future, the future of the planet, the progression of our society or human rights and equality. Maybe just money? How sad if that's the case.

[Justin O.]

I agree that gender politics is a real world issue that should be addressed. And I think gendering color is a small part of a large problem that goes back much further than the 80's or 40's. I don't know if this is the best place for this discourse, but I do agree it is important to address it when it comes up, because I don't think enough people think about how negatively impacting these casual, seemingly meaningless things, like gendering color, are. And I don't think that is a new thing. While I don't know that continuing this discussion is worthwhile, I felt it was important to speak up.

[theCapraAegagrus]

I hate these. Just kill it with fire.

[MagikFingerz]

And once again, Capra (The Artist Formerly Known As TwoPiece) is the one who steers the thread back on track

[STLBluesNut]

I guess maybe I am just old, but really? We are to the point were we are getting butthurt about colors now. I thought the snowflakes couldn't become any more ridiculous. I was wrong.

Sent from my S10+ using Tapatalk

[RelativityCards]

I don't want to wade in too deep here and I'm not going to diminish points made...

Am I the only one who remembers that their last pink deck came out on Father's Day and they marketed it around pink being a hip, dad-dude color?

[RelativityCards]

Fair point about edge cases not excusing anything. Like I said, I wasn't trying to invalidate an argument. It just felt lost; I mean, it is where this deck came from.

If you (not you specifically) were going to print a palette-swapped version of a pink deck, resulting in this deck, how would you market it? Not meant to be a challenge. Just seriously, what's a better approach?
Besides being more original than a palette-swap

[Justin O.]

Honestly I wouldn't use any allusions, I would just brand it as 'Ace Fulton's Pink'

I don't think you were invalidating anyone's argument, or being inflammatory, I think your comment brought up a fair question.