2018 'Deck of the Year' Awards: DISCUSSION

[sinjin7]

Hey everyone, it's that time of the year again - time for the 2018 Deck of the Year Contest! I feel that last year's contest suffered from starting too late and we didn't have sufficient time for proper promotion of the contest, which resulted in lackluster participation. I'm hoping this year we can get better organized earlier so that the contest can get back to being one of the highlights of the year. I have a feeling we can get some pretty special prize tiers for this year. I'll get the ball rolling by donating my usual custom brick of assorted decks from my personal collection, plus I will offer a special second brick that I've been putting together for years that I anticipate I will finally be able to complete before the end of this year (hopefully).

I know this is a hell of a lot of work to put together, and I am extremely grateful to Mike and all the mods that are involved in putting this contest together. I especially appreciate those who compile the list of eligible decks in any given year, every year that list gets longer and harder (insert the "that's what she said" joke) to put together with the proliferation of custom decks. We're already in mid-October so I think the time is ripe to start organizing and promoting the 2018 Deck of the Year Contest.

[Bradius]

I will be donating something myself this year. If I get it before we have to commit, it will be a full regular set of The Planets in an 8 deck carat case.

Anyway, it would help to again have the categories and I think PipChick knows of a spreadsheet we could reference for decks issued this year. We should also anticipate what other decks should be released before the end of the year. I can think of a ton of great decks released this year and several, like Maduro, that should be released before the end of the year. Another thought is to have folks from the group nominate decks and artists for the various categories. Then we either must pick from that list or let the list be a main option, but allow "write in" options.

I assume you will want us to complete a scoring form as well this year.

[rousselle]

Hey, all.

Last year, I picked up managing the contest/awards (albeit with help from several quarters) after montecarlojoe had to step aside from managing it -- he had carried the baton for the previous few years, if I recall correctly.

I agree that starting as late into the year as I did, even though it wasn't that much later than the previous year, cost us a lot of momentum.

That said, I don't think we should start actually voting until January. I do agree that now is a fine time to start discussing this year's rules, categories, and voter participation prizes.

We should also discuss who is going to take responsibility for running the contest this year. I am happy to pass the baton on, and I am also happy to carry it another year, as the situation merits. Would anyone like to volunteer to manage the contest and awards this year?



Last year's (and the previous year's) categories were:

• Best Ace of Spades
• Best Back
• Best Courts
• Best Pips
• Best Jokers
• Best Gaff/Extra Card
• Best Use of Colours in a Deck
• Best Deck for Flourishing
• Best Deck for Fanning
• Best Deck for Magic
• Best Uncut
• Best Tuck
• Best Coin
• Best Innovation
• Best Crowdfunding project
• Best Rookie Deck
• Best Non-Poker Deck
• Best Deck for Poker Play
• Best Overall

I propose that if we make any changes, we don't add or eliminate (or modify) more than two or three categories. Making too many changes from year to year, in my opinion, could weaken the sense of tradition and stability that our annual contest/awards have earned.

Thoughts?

[Adonael]

I see that there is a category there for best use of colours in a deck. Seeing how common foil is becoming with both tucks and cards, I would propose a 'Best use of Foil in a Deck' category.

[guru]

Here is the spreadsheet with majority of decks released in 2018 covered....

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/ ... sp=sharing" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[Bradius]

Thanks Guru, but the list I saw from the link seems to start with Kickstarter campaigns after March 2018. There were a number of earlier decks and even Kickstarter campaigns way back in 2017, that were not released until after Dec 31, 2017. The list I made is not as comprehensive, but does include earlier decks. Perhaps the spreadsheet I viewed was not filtering it correctly.

[JacksonRobinson]

I will donate a complete 1 year subscription for the 2019 Kings Wild Shorts series.

[PipChick]

Anyway, it would help to again have the categories and I think PipChick knows of a spreadsheet we could reference for decks issued this year. We should also anticipate what other decks should be released before the end of the year. I can think of a ton of great decks released this year and several, like Maduro, that should be released before the end of the year. Another thought is to have folks from the group nominate decks and artists for the various categories. Then we either must pick from that list or let the list be a main option, but allow "write in" options.

I assume you will want us to complete a scoring form as well this year.

Here is the spreadsheet with majority of decks released in 2018 covered....

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/ ... sp=sharing" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;"

Thanks Guru, but the list I saw from the link seems to start with Kickstarter campaigns after March 2018. There were a number of earlier decks and even Kickstarter campaigns way back in 2017, that were not released until after Dec 31, 2017. The list I made is not as comprehensive, but does include earlier decks. Perhaps the spreadsheet I viewed was not filtering it correctly.

Hi y'all,

So, I've been trying my best to keep the 2018 spreadsheet Guru posted above as up-to-date and comprehensively accurate as possible, but even I must admit that I'm sure there may be still the chance that some decks might have slipped through (most likely those released through less common/conventional outlets other than KS and/or the typical big online retailers), but only because I didn't/don't know of them - so, if anyone notices that there's a deck missing that hasn't been added, please, either let me know, or update the doc as you see fit

Also, while yes this spreadsheet covers quite a lot of 2018, I must also admit that, having only started it earlier this year - and largely with the prospect of it's useful application for exactly this contest in mind - it will be less than comprehensive in having the decks specifically from KS campaigns that started in 2017 or earlier and completed in 2018 listed; for example, off the top of my head, Minty's HANA decks - which I'll definitely be sure to add. The good news though is, having consistently kept up with the 2018 KS projects and those expected to complete in 2019, will definitely help in next year's spreadsheet in which I also plan to incorporate this specific sorta data into; just still trying to get the query formulas right to carry the data over along with some other, more efficient updates to the overall doc in how the data is organized lol (BTW, I'm in no way all that great in using Excel, so I'm just doing the best I can to my abilities and am still learning along the way; on top of that, I am just organizing the doc as I alone personally think is best, which I also recognize, may not actually be the best - so, any feedback and/or help would also be greatly appreciated - thanks! )

But, I'm glad this thread has been started because then it'll give me some time to dig around and add to/update with those 2017 KS decks that had been released this year and hopefully, we'll have a bit of a more comprehensive list in regards to all decks released in 2018 - it'll just take some time, but I plan to start by going back through the Watchdog thread - Allan's posts will be super helpful!!! and if there's any that anyone else can think of, please do let me know.

What I unfortunately can't donate in decks for this contest, I hope to make up for in helping out in any way I can and through my small contributions of time and effort

Speaking of which;

We should also discuss who is going to take responsibility for running the contest this year. I am happy to pass the baton on, and I am also happy to carry it another year, as the situation merits. Would anyone like to volunteer to manage the contest and awards this year?

what exact responsibilities does running this contest entail?? I'm pretty organized in these sorta things and might be able to manage helping out - or maybe a joint effort? I dunno, just curious and would be interested in more info before committing Thanks!

[machonekevin]

very nice Jackson.

[Bradius]

PipChick, I posted a list earlier this year of decks I had that were released this year, it is not near as comprehesive as the shared list and I kind of gave up on it halfway through the year. However, it probably will be a decent start at filling the missing decks released earlier in the year that your list is missing.

[PipChick]

PipChick, I posted a list earlier this year of decks I had that were released this year, it is not near as comprehesive as the shared list and I kind of gave up on it halfway through the year. However, it probably will be a decent start at filling the missing decks released earlier in the year that your list is missing.

any help would be greatly appreciated; send over whatever ya got and I'll take a look - Thanks!!

[Wizard_of_Os]

I had joined this forum, or at least began actively keeping up with it, shortly before last year’s contest. Tbh, I felt rather confused and overwhelmed by all of the activity surrounding it, hence my lack of participation. I believe this was a concern that was addressed throughout the previous contest. I definitely feel setting the stage earlier will help avoid a repeat of this issue.

Now that I’ve been a little more into the collecting scene for the year, I’m actually quite looking forward to being a part of this year’s contest. And thanks to all of you who put forth so much effort to make things like this happen (and generally keep the forum rolling altogether).

If there’s any way I can pitch in, I’d be more than happy to. I generally have some time and some administrative skills that could be helpful. I’d just need a direction to head; so if I can help share the load somebody let me know!

[Magic Tapp]

Being a newbie here, can I just ask a very dumb question - how does the contest work? Apologies if it has been covered before - if you could point me in the right direction, it would be greatly appreciated.

[Bradius]

Here is the earlier thread with my list and some others additions. It took longer to find than I thought it would...

viewtopic.php?f=81&t=11916

[Wizard_of_Os]

Being a newbie here, can I just ask a very dumb question - how does the contest work? Apologies if it has been covered before - if you could point me in the right direction, it would be greatly appreciated.

There’s a thread at the top of the New & Custom Decks forum that details last year’s contest:
viewtopic.php?f=8&t=11181" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[Bradius]

When we consider tucks, do we include special edition tucks like the Olive Legacy or Maduro Limited tucks, or just standard tucks? Personally, I would leave in Maduro Limited, but not include the Olive Legacy box.

[Stevecru]

Personally, I think there are way too many categories. Best for flourishing AND best for fanning? Come on....
I voted last year, but just for my favorite deck, nothing else.
I think you’ll get more participation if you trim the categories way down, no more than 5.
Best overall
Best tuck
Best handling
Best backs
Most creative

[Wizard_of_Os]

I understand the sentiment behind paring down the voting categories. I also understand wanting to give as many options as possible to recognize all of the amazing work produced throughout the year. Maybe the answer is somewhere in the middle? 5 seems maybe a little too condensed. Maybe it could be done with 10-12? Of course, I have more of collector’s point of view. Others may be happier with more categories.

[Räpylätassu]

Strongly against on cutting the number of categories.

Deciding on what to vote on isn't hard. Just sit down, take out the decks you have gotten this year in front of you and just look at your choises for each category one by one. Basically saying that doing about 30 minutes of thinking in peace is all the actual work you'll have to do to on deciding your votes. I just don't understand how hard that can be.

And if you don't have your votes set after 30 minutes of thinking, you are overthinking it. If you can't decide your pick for example the best tuckbox between your two favorite tuckboxes of the year, flip a coin. By the time it is on the air, you know which way you want it to land.

And I am going to donate something again this year as well, most likely once again featuring some not so common decks.

[PipChick]

I agree that there are quite a lot of categories and, having sooooo many decks to have been released this year, it's intimidating to even know where to start. But, if I had to eliminate, change, or merge any of them, this is how I would if it were up to me (ones in red are those categories I would eliminate altogether):

• Best Ace of Spades
• Best Back
• Best Courts
• Best Pips (don't get me wrong, I love me some nice pips just as much as the next guy, but, IMHO, I don't imagine many people are getting decks based solely on the amazing design of a custom pip so I don't see the point in voting for a deck based on that alone.)
• Best Jokers
• Best Gaff/Extra Card
• Best Use of Colours in a Deck (just seems excessive to me)
• Best Deck for Fanning & Flourishing
• Best Deck for Magic
• Best Uncut (I can't imagine many decks that would only win best uncut and not any of the other categories... just seems kinda redundant IMHO)
• Best Tuck
• Best Coin (only because I'd wanna keep this contest just about decks; otherwise, sooner or later, other add-ons would also have to be up for consideration as well and, let's face it, that's not why were all in this hobby to begin with, amiright?)
• Best Innovation
• Best Crowdfunding project (I just don't like this category; first off, because it's going to be quite subjective from person to person and there's a lot of other, unrelated factors that can play a role in choosing one over another and second, because if the deck design is great on it's own, it'll be a strong contender for any of the other categories anyways, so this just feels unnecessary)
• Best Rookie Deck
• Best Non-Poker Deck (if the deck is not best for poker, not best for magic and not best for fanning, than why not just rename this category "Best custom deck")
• Best Deck for Poker Play
• Best Overall

Now, this is all just how I would personally narrow down the number of categories from 19 to 13 (if we all even choose to make any changes and/or do so at all); some might think this is too much and others might think it's not enough, but it's just my own thoughts and brief rationale on the matter for why I would eliminate the categories in red

I would however suggest maybe considering to add the category of ‘Best Branded Deck’ – This would be where, for example, JR’s Tally Ho: Olive Edition or the Tally Ho: Cardistry Edition or any new Bicycle branded decks to have hit the market whether through KS projects or directly to retail would be contenders for recognition. I feel that these decks, considering that most of them (with the exception of JR's Legacy Edition) are typically designed with much more simple features, are not given quite the love they deserve despite often being some of the first decks people are exposed to from early on and the affordability and accessibility such mass produced branded decks provide to the market for collectors, magicians, cardists & game players alike. Plus, unlike many of the other categories, this would be one with such a defined parameter that a vast majority of decks released this past year just won’t qualify and make voting, IMHO, A LOT easier when having to select only from among the few that do. Also, I admit I gotta bit of a soft spot for the 'ol classics lol

[Bradius]

I do like the category Best use of colors in a deck I am thinking of some decks like the Tea Art deck by Carne Griffiths https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/34 ... ink-tea-an or NEO:Wave Ultra by Montenzi https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/mo ... neo%3AWave just to name two. The use of color well I think gives special recognition unique and in addition to other recognition in my opinion.

I also really like best crowdfunding project. A series like Apothecary II, Elixer, The Planets comes to mind, and also those campaigns that communicate well and get their rewards sent on time or ahead of time. Yes, this is another good category in my opinion.

I could make arguments against the other categories you mentioned, but others may see the importance.

I also would like to see a "Best use of Foil" category this year.

[MagikFingerz]

I'd be ok with eliminating all the categories Amy highlighted, though I agree with Brad re: Use of Colors.

As for "Best Non-Poker Deck", I believe that is meant for tarot, hana fuda, or other "special" (to us, anyway) decks. Not sure what else it could be called to make that more apparent.

[PipChick]

I also really like best crowdfunding project. A series like Apothecary II, Elixer, The Planets comes to mind, and also those campaigns that communicate well and get their rewards sent on time or ahead of time. Yes, this is another good category in my opinion.

The thing with the 'Best Crowdfunding Project' category is that not every backer's experience is going to be similar and I think that can greatly vary between US backers vs. International backers in particular. Also, when we're tollin' out praise for such things as "good communication" and "delivering on time", it kinda feels like it's just a glorified participation category - creators should already be striving for that as a minimum to managing a campaign - it's their responsibility to be keeping us updated on projects and, while delays can and do occur, that's not necessarily within the control of the creator and I don't think should negatively reflect on their overall management of a project.

Take a look at the case with Lorenzo on the HotRS project in which he clearly and concisely laid out every step of the process in every component of the project and the current status of each (even took the time to do so with simple visuals) which, I think we can all agree, is going waaay above and beyond in that regard and greatly appreciated. But on the other hand, the project was, ultimately, late by 2 months and for me personally, I ended up having to change my shipping arrangements and eat the additional costs in doing so; does that mean that the project wasn't 'good' or ran well? I wouldn't by any means even consider it so - on the contrary, a very well run campaign worthy of praise; but was it "the best"? maybe for some, others maybe not so much. But would another campaign that might be equally well managed and delivered on time or ahead of schedule despite having waaay less components and moving parts to it really be considered "better"? I dunno, to me, it's like comparing apples to oranges.

[PipChick]

As for "Best Non-Poker Deck", I believe that is meant for tarot, hana fuda, or other "special" (to us, anyway) decks. Not sure what else it could be called to make that more apparent.

ah, okay, gotcha; now I understand the rationale behind the name - thanks for the clarification; I guess I just didn't even considered that this category would have such a wide qualifying parameters to include just any card decks at all lol.

Btw Bradius, that Carne Griffiths deck and others like it might suit well in a new "Best Art Deck" category - also, considering that not too many of these types of decks are released every year, it might be easier to vote on due to the already narrowed down criteria.

[Wizard_of_Os]

I do agree with Bradius on the best use of color category. I wouldn’t want to take that one out. And I like the idea of adding a foil category. I could take or leave the crowdfunding category. One of the categories I thought could maybe be dropped is the best extra/gaff card? I haven’t seen any that stand out as exceptional or radically different. I also don’t use them every day as I barely dabble in the magic side anymore.

[sinjin7]

I am also in favor of streamlining the categories, but not by too much. Here are the categories I would like to see for the contest:

The absolutely essential categories:
Best Overall Deck of the Year
Best Tuck Box
Best Back Design
Best Court Cards
Best Ace of Spades
Best Jokers

The genre specific categories (because we're the forum for all things Cardistry, Magic, and Custom decks):
Best Cardistry/Flourishing/XCM Deck
Best Fanning Deck
Best Deck for Magic
Best Gaff/Extra Card

The categories I like, but can also live without:
Best Innovation
Best Non-Poker Deck (Tarot, Throwing Cards, Trainer Decks, Hana Fuda, etc..)
Best Use of Colors

The categories I would cut:
Best Uncut - too niche and redundant.
Best Coin - too niche and not about cards.
Best Pips
Best Rookie Deck - too many decks to keep track of, some years there are no good rookie decks.
Best Crowdfunding Project - a relevant category in the early years when there weren't so many KS decks, but now too many.
Best Deck for Poker - this is basically any deck with standard courts or jumbo indeces.
Best Series - I think this was already cut last year, but let's make sure to keep it out.

The only category I would consider adding may be for Best Use of Foil, but I think this category may become irrelevant fairly soon because foiling technology will advance to the degree where it will be a common feature in the near future.

Personally, I think there are way too many categories. Best for flourishing AND best for fanning? Come on....

It seems like Tom or I have to address this every year. Fanning is a major subset of Cardistry as a whole and important enough to merit it's own category. Of all the cardistry moves, fanning is the one aspect of cardistry that is the most specifically affected by playing card design. Finally, I think it would be a travesty to have cardistry reduced to a single lone category for a contest sponsored by a site that originated as a cardistry forum.

[Eric Lee]

Definitely agree with sinjin7 here.

Streamlining the categories will definitely help, especially with the newbies on this site. Create sub-catergories like cardistry/flourishing/XCM and magic will help bring cater to the everyone.

Also agree with the categories to cut out here. Too niche for the rest and crowdfunding is way to subjective as Amy had stated earlier.

However in place of the removed categories, I would suggest putting in Worst Deck printed with reasons stated. Kinda like the Raspberries award. The one with the most funniest and sarcastic remarks wins! This is done entirely tongue in cheek.

Hmm... would it be too sensitive considering how touchy some creatives can get? Seen enough flamewars here to burn down the Amazon in my brief time here. Or would Hartsoe already win it handsdown?

[guru]

I also really like best crowdfunding project. A series like Apothecary II, Elixer, The Planets comes to mind, and also those campaigns that communicate well and get their rewards sent on time or ahead of time. Yes, this is another good category in my opinion.

The thing is with the 'Best Crowdfunding Project' category is that not every backer's experience is going to be similar and I think that can greatly vary between US backers vs. International backers in particular. Also, when we're tollin' out praise for such things as "good communication" and "delivering on time", it kinda feels like it's just a glorified participation category - creators should already be striving for that as a minimum to managing a campaign - it's their responsibility to be keeping us updated on projects and, while delays can and do occur, that's not necessarily within the control of the creator and I don't think should negatively reflect on their overall management of a project.

Take a look at the case with Lorenzo on the HotRS project in which he clearly and concisely laid out every step of the process in every component of the project and the current status of each (even took the time to do so with simple visuals) which, I think we can all agree, is going waaay above and beyond in that regard and greatly appreciated. But on the other hand, the project was, ultimately, late by 2 months and for me personally, I ended up having to change my shipping arrangements and eat the additional costs in doing so; does that mean that the project wasn't 'good' or ran well? I wouldn't by any means even consider it so - on the contrary, a very well run campaign worthy of praise; but was it "the best"? maybe for some, others maybe not so much. But would another campaign that might be equally well managed and delivered on time or ahead of schedule despite having waaay less components and moving parts to it really be considered "better"? I dunno, to me, it's like comparing apples to oranges.

@Pipchick has articulated it extremely well here. Communication, regular updates should be a given already. US vs International backers experience is another thing altogether. I could say I have tried managing it well be it shipping price, packaging, tracking and no VAT/ tax for UK/EU but there is still scope for improvement.

I thing there are a number of variables leading to the best crowdfunding project experience and most here won't even be aware of them.

[guru]

I'm going to donate a brick of Kalevala Playing Cards Standard edition this time.

[Magic Tapp]

I am also in favor of streamlining the categories, but not by too much. Here are the categories I would like to see for the contest:

The absolutely essential categories:
Best Overall Deck of the Year
Best Tuck Box
Best Back Design
Best Court Cards
Best Ace of Spades
Best Jokers

The genre specific categories (because we're the forum for all things Cardistry, Magic, and Custom decks):
Best Cardistry/Flourishing/XCM Deck
Best Fanning Deck
Best Deck for Magic
Best Gaff/Extra Card

The categories I like, but can also live without:
Best Innovation
Best Non-Poker Deck (Tarot, Throwing Cards, Trainer Decks, Hana Fuda, etc..)
Best Use of Colors

The categories I would cut:
Best Uncut - too niche and redundant.
Best Coin - too niche and not about cards.
Best Pips
Best Rookie Deck - too many decks to keep track of, some years there are no good rookie decks.
Best Crowdfunding Project - a relevant category in the early years when there weren't so many KS decks, but now too many.
Best Deck for Poker - this is basically any deck with standard courts or jumbo indeces.
Best Series - I think this was already cut last year, but let's make sure to keep it out.

The only category I would consider adding may be for Best Use of Foil, but I think this category may become irrelevant fairly soon because foiling technology will advance to the degree where it will be a common feature in the near future.

Personally, I think there are way too many categories. Best for flourishing AND best for fanning? Come on....

It seems like Tom or I have to address this every year. Fanning is a major subset of Cardistry as a whole and important enough to merit it's own category. Of all the cardistry moves, fanning is the one aspect of cardistry that is the most specifically affected by playing card design. Finally, I think it would be a travesty to have cardistry reduced to a single lone category for a contest sponsored by a site that originated as a cardistry forum.

I am approaching this from the collector's perspective and do not really have a strong opinion on the genre specific categories.

Overall, I think 5 categories will be too few - 10 to 12 would be better.

Of those falling into "nice to have but can live without" category, I would definitely want to keep the "best use of colour" and "best innovation" and would also second the suggestion for the "best use of foil" introduction.

As regards the best crowdfunding project, I am thinking that perhaps the way to do it would be to narrow it to something like "best interaction with backers" (although I do take the point that this is something that should happening on each KS project but we all know that it is not the case). Then again, I would not mind if it does not make the cut.