RADIA, The Spiritual Successor to AURUM by Encarded

[Bradius]

Yeah, Paul or other deck producers. Don’t try to make me happy with an extra sticker. Just...don’t. No.

[sms69x]

But I'm sure it is a stunning sticker laser-cut on his new laser cut thing...

[theCapraAegagrus]

But I'm sure it is a stunning sticker laser-cut on his new laser cut thing...

Spoiler Alert: It's not.

If it was a sexy sticker I might actually be satisfied. It's a pretty bland sticker.

[alric]

Holy shit! Paul makes this proclamation that he's going to make it up to his supporters for his late decks.....and he does it with a sticker? Like that will salvage the reputation hit he took? He must think we're as dumb as Trump. When you guys first started talking about stickers, I thought you were joking.

[Cardians]

I thought you were joking.

I just guessed, but ya it's a kick in the nuts for sure...!

[Bradius]

It was such a bland sticker, I don't even remember it. I just threw it away. I looked for it before responding. I found a few other stickers, but not that one.

[sms69x]

So after all the waiting - much like any other KS project, except this was not a KS project, and we were told that the decks were shipping short after pre-order - I finally received my order... But the wait was well worth it, look at what I got inside:

Not one but two fantastic stickers!!

Now onto the deck, I tried to open it very carefully, because of the before mentioned issue with the ink on the seal, but even so I managed to get the number on the cellophane:

Not only I have now a partially numbered seal I also have a partially numbered cellophane, this must be the special hidden feature Paul didn't want to disclose in the first place.

The deck is just an ok deck. The artwork is very average (or Chancellor'ish) and the back design is a bit better, but nothing breathtaking. This was most likely my last buy from Paul, at least in this blind format.

All in all I think this deck was just over hyped and over priced, a bold move from Paul, that worked in his favor in the short term (after all he managed to sell all the decks in a few days), but it may very well do him more harm than good in the middle term...

[theCapraAegagrus]

So after all the waiting - much like any other KS project, except this was not a KS project, and we were told that the decks were shipping short after pre-order - I finally received my order... But the wait was well worth it, look at what I got inside:

DSC_00321.jpg

Not one but two fantastic stickers!!

Now onto the deck, I tried to open it very carefully, because of the before mentioned issue with the ink on the seal, but even so I managed to get the number on the cellophane:

DSC_00301.jpg

Not only I have now a partially numbered seal I also have a partially numbered cellophane, this must be the special hidden feature Paul didn't want to disclose in the first place.

The deck is just an ok deck. The artwork is very average (or Chancellor'ish) and the back design is a bit better, but nothing breathtaking. This was most likely my last buy from Paul, at least in this blind format.

All in all I think this deck was just over hyped and over priced, a bold move from Paul, that worked in his favor in the short term (after all he managed to sell all the decks in a few days), but it may very well do him more harm than good in the middle term...

I have to respectfully and emphatically disagree with the artwork being "average". The number problems on the seals is a huge let down, though.

[Bradius]

I am concerned about the seals not being printed well. This is a big problem and something I would not expect from an experienced card producer. I am not out, but I hope this is a rare exception. That said, I did like the artwork, but the production failures and long delay in receiving them did leave a bad taste in my mouth. That said, Paul was very fast to respond to my emails asking about the production delays, so you get plus points for timely responding, even if it wasn't the best news. I would rather hear bad news than completely ignoring my communications. Sadly, I have that happen on several Kickstarter projects (not so much playing card projects).

[sms69x]

Because the "Chancellor Ultra Limited Gilded Money Grab" deck is getting a bit of heat, I tough it was time to update some of more problems with the "Radia Super Hipped Rip-off money" deck.

A friend of mine from China when got his decks, at least one of them was in the condition bellow:

After contacting Paul the answer his got was "the technology is more difficult; ... it was normal", no need to explain that no replacement was sent nor even a fantastic encarded sticker was given for free..

This guy is a one hit wonder who lived in the shadow of one deck (Aurum) for too many time, and he found out that ripping people's money was ok, since people were giving the money at him without hesitation - yeah I know, if poeple were giving him the money that's not ripping-off, but since the product delivered was always sub-par, then for me it is ripping-off - so why not keep doing the same until the bubble bursts? And I think it brust, FINALLY..

So an word of advise, for new members, be very careful about Paul Carpenter and Encarded. It is not because the designer or company is in the business for some years that he won't screw you if he got the chance.

[theCapraAegagrus]

This guy is a one hit wonder who lived in the shadow of one deck (Aurum) for too many time, and he found out that ripping people's money was ok, since people were giving the money at him without hesitation - yeah I know, if poeple were giving him the money that's not ripping-off, but since the product delivered was always sub-par, then for me it is ripping-off - so why not keep doing the same until the bubble bursts? And I think it brust, FINALLY..

So an word of advise, for new members, be very careful about Paul Carpenter and Encarded. It is not because the designer or company is in the business for some years that he won't screw you if he got the chance.

Well, he can't be a 1-hit wonder if one person that Zenith is his only great deck, and another says that Aurum is his only great deck... On top of having more than a handful of great decks.

He specifically said that this process may never be used again because of its difficulty. That's public knowledge. IMO it would be nice of him to send a replacement, but it's not like he HAS to.

[tapunan]

Uhm why should he not replace an expensive deck with a production damage like that. I was actually thinking of buying Radia sometime next month but based on this, will not go ahead.

[theCapraAegagrus]

Uhm why should he not replace an expensive deck with a production damage like that. I was actually thinking of buying Radia sometime next month but based on this, will not go ahead.

I didn't say that he "shouldn't", but he isn't obligated to... I mean, first of all, we're not receiving knowledge first-hand. Did this Chinese buyer purchase directly from Encarded? If not, then I would certainly argue that he definitely shouldn't replace it. Also, I just can't fathom a scenario in which a card comes out of a seal tuck like that.

I wasn't going to say so earlier, but since you responded, this just sounds like a scam to me. It looks intentionally peeled off. Otherwise, this would be an isolated incident, among a thousand decks. The likelihood of you receiving a deck in this condition seems close-to-impossible.

I think that people get far too entitled, RE: to replacement decks, just because there happen to be some outlets that don't hesitate to provide them. If a limited deck is sealed and sold, how/why is it the retailer's fault? If they don't willingly replace it, there are buyer protection clauses for a reason. Every bank and credit card company have them (some better than others). This type of attitude can get out of hand easily.

[vasta41]

Uhm why should he not replace an expensive deck with a production damage like that. I was actually thinking of buying Radia sometime next month but based on this, will not go ahead.

I didn't say that he "shouldn't", but he isn't obligated to... I mean, first of all, we're not receiving knowledge first-hand. Did this Chinese buyer purchase directly from Encarded? If not, then I would certainly argue that he definitely shouldn't replace it. Also, I just can't fathom a scenario in which a card comes out of a seal tuck like that.

I wasn't going to say so earlier, but since you responded, this just sounds like a scam to me. It looks intentionally peeled off. Otherwise, this would be an isolated incident, among a thousand decks. The likelihood of you receiving a deck in this condition seems close-to-impossible.

I think that people get far too entitled, RE: to replacement decks, just because there happen to be some outlets that don't hesitate to provide them. If a limited deck is sealed and sold, how/why is it the retailer's fault? If they don't willingly replace it, there are buyer protection clauses for a reason. Every bank and credit card company have them (some better than others). This type of attitude can get out of hand easily.

I completely agree with 2pc here. I'm no detective but if the card came out-of-the-box like that then how could it have possibly curled up? There's no room for a fart in tuck boxes so there's no possible way for a card to come out of a box like that. Paul has made his mistakes, no doubt. But if I were him and saw that picture I would say, "be more careful next time!"

[sms69x]

Well, he can't be a 1-hit wonder if one person that Zenith is his only great deck, and another says that Aurum is his only great deck... On top of having more than a handful of great decks.

Should've add IMO (sorry about that)

He specifically said that this process may never be used again because of its difficulty. That's public knowledge. IMO it would be nice of him to send a replacement, but it's not like he HAS to.

Yeah "difficult" doesn't mean that the cards may not all be perfect playable in my book. Instead of him hypping the deck as he did if he only admited that things my not turn out perfect and some issues, like the one I posted, may happen maybe he wouldn't have sold out that deck so quick. But again I guess he's not here to be transparent, he's just here when he needs some extra money...

... I mean, first of all, we're not receiving knowledge first-hand. Did this Chinese buyer purchase directly from Encarded?

Yes he bought the deck directly from Encarded. Otherwise it wouldn't make sense to even request a replacement or refund from Paul.. Sure he could contact him to try to get an explanation, but not expecting a replacement.

I wasn't going to say so earlier, but since you responded, this just sounds like a scam to me. It looks intentionally peeled off. Otherwise, this would be an isolated incident, among a thousand decks. The likelihood of you receiving a deck in this condition seems close-to-impossible.

It sounds more like a fanboy talking... But that's my opinion only.
Due to the limited amount of decks sold (1000 if I'm not mistaken) and the limit purchase per buyer (4) I doubt that many people will open their decks.. So assuming that is "close-to-impossible" situation is a bit of a stretch, but then again is my opinion.

[theCapraAegagrus]

Well, he can't be a 1-hit wonder if one person that Zenith is his only great deck, and another says that Aurum is his only great deck... On top of having more than a handful of great decks.

Should've add IMO (sorry about that)

He specifically said that this process may never be used again because of its difficulty. That's public knowledge. IMO it would be nice of him to send a replacement, but it's not like he HAS to.

Yeah "difficult" doesn't mean that the cards may not all be perfect playable in my book. Instead of him hypping the deck as he did if he only admited that things my not turn out perfect and some issues, like the one I posted, may happen maybe he wouldn't have sold out that deck so quick. But again I guess he's not here to be transparent, he's just here when he needs some extra money...

... I mean, first of all, we're not receiving knowledge first-hand. Did this Chinese buyer purchase directly from Encarded?

Yes he bought the deck directly from Encarded. Otherwise it wouldn't make sense to even request a replacement or refund from Paul.. Sure he could contact him to try to get an explanation, but not expecting a replacement.

I wasn't going to say so earlier, but since you responded, this just sounds like a scam to me. It looks intentionally peeled off. Otherwise, this would be an isolated incident, among a thousand decks. The likelihood of you receiving a deck in this condition seems close-to-impossible.

It sounds more like a fanboy talking... But that's my opinion only.
Due to the limited amount of decks sold (1000 if I'm not mistaken) and the limit purchase per buyer (4) I doubt that many people will open their decks.. So assuming that is "close-to-impossible" situation is a bit of a stretch, but then again is my opinion.

Hey, thanks for having a civil discussion. Sometimes things get out of whack here when we disagree.

Am I a fan of Paul Carpenter? Yes, but I'm not above criticizing him if he makes a mistake. The tuck seals on these decks were very poor. I'm not a top-notch physicist or anything, but the image itself doesn't lend any understanding as to how or why that would occur allegedly "out of the box".

IIRC, Paul did shared the production problems before delivering the decks. That's where the knowledge of the hellish production process comes from. It was such a pain for both Encarded and EPCC that the Taiwanese printer will likely never do this again. The quality of the deck that I received and opened is in the A-range. It's not 100% perfect, I think there were some light scratches on some card backs that could only be seen in very bright light reflection, but it wasn't bad enough or often enough to dislike.

[guru]

It was such a pain for both Encarded and EPCC that the Taiwanese printer will likely never do this again.

Small correction - Radia is printed in China and not in Taiwan.

[sms69x]

I'm not a top-notch physicist or anything, but the image itself doesn't lend any understanding as to how or why that would occur allegedly "out of the box".

I never said that the curl happened "out of the box". What happened, and was what I wanted to show, is that the back was already un-glued from the card, the curl just happens naturally once you have the card resting withou any heavy weight on it (you can try it with your Radia deck).
Have you checked how your Radia deck is bowed in in upward direction (cards facing down)?? Mine is under two other decks and still show a big bow. I'll try to snap a shoot later today when I get home.

[theCapraAegagrus]

I'm not a top-notch physicist or anything, but the image itself doesn't lend any understanding as to how or why that would occur allegedly "out of the box".

I never said that the curl happened "out of the box". What happened, and was what I wanted to show, is that the back was already un-glued from the card, the curl just happens naturally once you have the card resting withou any heavy weight on it (you can try it with your Radia deck).
Have you checked how your Radia deck is bowed in in upward direction (cards facing down)?? Mine is under two other decks and still show a big bow. I'll try to snap a shoot later today when I get home.

I haven't had any of these problems. Could it be a weather thing? I could see problems occuring in higher temperatures or humid climates. My cards are never in humid conditions and haven't been exposed to temperatures above 75 degrees Fahrenheit.

[sinjin7]

IMO it would be nice of him to send a replacement, but it's not like he HAS to.

Actually, he does. It's called the Implied Warranty of Merchantability. Consumers have a right to receive goods that meet their expectations and are what they're supposed to be. Unless Paul utilized express disclaimers on the functionality of his decks in his promotion of Radia (and he did not), then he IS obligated to offer a functional replacement or a refund.

This deck was produced in China? I don't recall that being mentioned either. Given it's track record, I don't know why anyone would still buy decks made by EPCC/LPCC in China.

[akicer]

Okay, repost my two cents on this Chinese guy.

I know that guy as well, he's quite famous among Chinese collectors, but with a bad reputation. He created a thread showing how he ripped off the Radia card in a Chinese forum. A natural question is, did he do that because of seeing the broken card? Or did he took the picture while he was trying to rip the back off? I don't know and I don't care to know, to me not all buyer's comment worth looking at.

[sms69x]

Okay, repost my two cents on this Chinese guy.

I know that guy as well, he's quite famous among Chinese collectors, but with a bad reputation. He created a thread showing how he ripped off the Radia card in a Chinese forum. A natural question is, did he do that because of seeing the broken card? Or did he took the picture while he was trying to rip the back off? I don't know and I don't care to know, to me not all buyer's comment worth looking at.

Well not sure if the same guy or not. When I talked with him I explicitly asked if the card was that way "out of the box" (meaning the back already unglued) to which he responded "yes". So I have no reason not to trust him. But I may not know his full background, as you clearly seem to know.

[sms69x]

I'm not a top-notch physicist or anything, but the image itself doesn't lend any understanding as to how or why that would occur allegedly "out of the box".

I never said that the curl happened "out of the box". What happened, and was what I wanted to show, is that the back was already un-glued from the card, the curl just happens naturally once you have the card resting withou any heavy weight on it (you can try it with your Radia deck).
Have you checked how your Radia deck is bowed in in upward direction (cards facing down)?? Mine is under two other decks and still show a big bow. I'll try to snap a shoot later today when I get home.

I haven't had any of these problems. Could it be a weather thing? I could see problems occuring in higher temperatures or humid climates. My cards are never in humid conditions and haven't been exposed to temperatures above 75 degrees Fahrenheit.

Here the Radia bow:

Radia on the left

IMG_2551.JPG (134.21 KiB) Viewed 16217 times

Radia on the left, on the right is the Arthurian deck, which was also printed in China.
As you can see that's a pretty nasty bow, it isn't even worst because it is storaged under two other decks.

[hawk199]

Woah from Singapore here and just checked my open / 1 and only radia

My deck is the same as the picture above haha.
Day 1 open, played with it a bit and store in my cabernet. My other decks fine, only radia warp this badly


And for my opinion about Paul, he tries to use words to get out of trouble and big headed (his fans defended him)

Why? It's based off my case where I complaint about his shipping method (Ordered 2 deck were basically sliding side to side which cased some damage to only 1) and the deck back has shit loads of scratches.

And asking for replacement (tuck case had dent, dirth etc) he ask me to pay for shipping to send over back to him -.-

(Emailed 1st then got pissed with his big headed attitude and called him out on facebook)

[montenzi]

1. I can only comment the photo posted earlier. This guy is trying to remove foil from the back. That's it. Very unnatural.

2. Remember foil expands when heated. It's metal. And I believe it was a bad idea to use 100% foil on the back.

3. Good cold foil adhesive == quality (not only). Check out more about a printing process https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cold_foil_printing

[guru]

Any good printer would have told Paul not to go on this path to get this done. It is not about any special technology.

I believe we have put so much hype around all these playing cards may be due to the competition these days.

Foil makes the card warp at some point of time and climate also plays a factor. I have seen warping on metaluxe & MPC Impression decks as well, and I can see that Radia has fully foiled card back. No wonder customers are seeing warped cards. People don't open decks from Lotrek and if they would, I am sure you will see a similar instance playing there. This is manufacturing guys, there are a number of variable and factors involved. Foil always has a risk involved in production as well as afterwards. I don't think blaming a creator on such an issue (warping) is good. Whether it is done by Cartamundi or USPCC or LPCC, or in China, you will see warping on any such type of designs with a note that humid climate can speed it up than the rest.


Few months back I came up with a fully foiled design (multiple foils etc.) and forwarded it to a printer to understand the doability, cost etc.

Their response is below:

Complete foil is okay and doable. It is easy to do but do not recommend it. Your customers will complain.
Large areas of full gold foil can easily produce scratches. And from the borders, the foil will fall off. Check this picture.

I didn't pursue that concept due to the response above.

PS: I can't show the picture of the card/deck here which they showed to me. Hope that's alright. Most of you will get the gist from their response.

[montenzi]

@guru, Don't want to hijack this thread so it's my last post in this topic. I had a chance to print my latest project with the same printer but know what? There is absolutely no reason to risk printing in China at the same price. Cartamundi is one of a kind in this field! They are incredible. Also please don't compare Metalluxe and Cold foil. They are very different. Metalluxe is a hot foil stamping so you cannot produce full bleed cards and cannot apply foil both sides. Plus lack of details and quality. IMHO there is absolutely no chances for epcc/lpcc to beat Cartamundi. Don't want to explain. Both companies are slowly dying . 1-2 years max.

[guru]

@guru, Don't want to hijack this thread so it's my last post in this topic. I had a chance to print my latest project with the same printer but know what? There is absolutely no reason to risk printing in China at the same price. Cartamundi is one of a kind in this field! They are incredible. Also please don't compare Metalluxe and Cold foil. They are very different. Metalluxe is a hot foil stamping so you cannot produce full bleed cards and cannot apply foil both sides. Plus lack of details and quality. IMHO there is absolutely no chances for epcc/lpcc to beat Cartamundi. Don't want to explain. Both companies are slowly dying . 1-2 years max.

@Montenzi - Interesting views or what I can say, opinion, perhaps.

Anyways, keeping it on topic, I do understand about hot foil vs cold foiling process. Whether Radia used cold foil or hot foil is immaterial to the fact that in the end, the card back has a full layer of foil applied to it.

" Remember foil expands when heated. It's metal. And I believe it was a bad idea to use 100% foil on the back."

Radia, in all its likelihood, used cold foiling on the back. Having a full bleed foil on the card back has its consequences. Even if it had borders with white space, I can bet that some customers (high humid climate) would have found this warping problem in a day or two after receiving their decks even if they didn't opened the decks immediately after receiving it.

No creator or even any printing company can bet that their decks won't have the warping issue.

[hawk199]

Should have disclaimer...like how LPCC did with one if their deck...orange colour bleeds

Thank guru and montezi for your knowledge

[IAmTheChin]

Regarding the peeled card, there is no way that was like that out of the box. I'm guessing it was flaking and he started picking at it. It's probably very easy to split an all foil back card from base stock. But the fact that it was curled (metal or not) means it wasn't sitting in a box for weeks at a time. I split cards a lot and I literally put them in boxes to sit specifically to remove that curling.

Also please don't compare Metalluxe and Cold foil. They are very different. Metalluxe is a hot foil stamping so you cannot produce full bleed cards and cannot apply foil both sides. Plus lack of details and quality. IMHO there is absolutely no chances for epcc/lpcc to beat Cartamundi. Don't want to explain. Both companies are slowly dying . 1-2 years max.

People use hot stamping because it has a more brilliant shine in both luminosity and color. It's because they're foiling from a specific foil color. Cold foil can't match the shine (lumen count).
Cold foil is great though because you can do multiple colors and get awesome detailing on it but that's because you're literally printing on a base color foil. You're still using a plate so any detail and color that would be achievable beyond a hot foil process is because it's the printed design on top of the foil (not the foiling itself). But a big plus is that it doesn't have the stamping problem.

IMO call me a traditionalist but if you're a Blaine and can do a single foil I still personally love hot foil more. You can spot a cold foil vs a hot foil a mile away. But the second you introduce a second color it's almost always easier and way more cost effective to go cold.