Kings Wild Project, Arthurian

[jsantafe]

A "display" deck should be given for free to Camelot backers, as I stated in a comment. No stretch goals or anything gift in a overfunded campaign. That's sad, and unjustified for a Kickstarter project

[Cardians]

A "display" deck should be given for free to Camelot backers, as I stated in a comment. No stretch goals or anything gift in a overfunded campaign. That's sad, and unjustified for a Kickstarter project

This is another example of the greed Jackson has. For anyone to seek free shipping or a free deck is like him selling one of his legs. It will never happen, EVER!

[jerichoholic]

He gave free display decks once and then realized he could cash in on it.

[TGunitedcardists]

He gave free display decks once and then realized he could cash in on it.

I think the lowest price was $5 on display decks, once.

[RichK]

He gave free display decks once and then realized he could cash in on it.

I think the lowest price was $5 on display decks, once.

Independence Ltd. (Continental/Crown) backers only got free display decks. Those were the days...

But those of us who pledged for the expensive Camelot deck get a JR signed key card that tells us who is on each court. Everyone else who pledged gets an unsigned one.

[Justin O.]

The hate is real

[sms69x]

The hate is real

Not sure if that's the case.

For a guy that states that one of his first priorities is to provide decks at the most affordable prices, he most of the times do the opposite..
Take the Camelot edition, the deck was suppose to be a limited edition of 1000, and thus he priced the deck at that high price, but all the sudden - and because people were asking for an opportunity to get the Camelot edition, and being JR such a nice guy - he decided to offer Camelot display decks, which means that the Camelot edition is not limited anymore (sure you can say it will be limited to 2500 or so, but most of KS decks are limited even if 5000+ are produced), so the premium price asked is not justified anymore. Did the backers beneficed for this expansion of number of decks produced? NO. Did JR beneficed? SURE YES, and by alot...

So your statement is not at all suitable in this case, is just a matter of not being a fan boy, and see the situation as it is. A nice way for JR to cash alot of money without doing a thing, and in the proccess totally disrespect people that pledge for his high priced "limited" decks

[PrincessTrouble]

All backers? Not just the ones who buy Camelot The Full Experience? Where did you see this?

Edit: ARGH! I see it now! An update that I hadn't noticed. ARGH!!!!! Now, I'm really, really displeased. Wish I'd seen this five minutes earlier.

Grumble, grumble.

Yep, that rubbed me the wrong way too. Not cool. Grumble.

I also dislike the video updates. Give us the meat of the update in written form and supplement with a video if you want. Don't make me go watch a video to get the information.

As for his new project manager, the jury is still out on her (at least for me). But I can say I wholeheartedly miss Marcus' involvement in KW. I at least felt listened to, even if I didn't get the answer I wanted. And I felt a lot more informed.

[RichK]

All backers? Not just the ones who buy Camelot The Full Experience? Where did you see this?

Edit: ARGH! I see it now! An update that I hadn't noticed. ARGH!!!!! Now, I'm really, really displeased. Wish I'd seen this five minutes earlier.

Grumble, grumble.

Yep, that rubbed me the wrong way too. Not cool. Grumble.

I also dislike the video updates. Give us the meat of the update in written form and supplement with a video if you want. Don't make me go watch a video to get the information.

As for his new project manager, the jury is still out on her (at least for me). But I can say I wholeheartedly miss Marcus' involvement in KW. I at least felt listened to, even if I didn't get the answer I wanted. And I felt a lot more informed.

No, it wasn't cool to let others get the display deck.

Jackson said in one of his videos that he has a hard time putting in text what he can say out loud. I know it was in reaction to us backers being angry about some change he did to a card deck or lack of updates or something.

As for Delanie she needs some updating work. Sure saying "all is on track" doesn't cut it. I don't know about her messaging responses, if she or Jackson handles that. Marcus was excellent.

[rousselle]

"Here's a screen shot of the map showing the progress our decks are making as they sail the ocean blue."

THAT would be cool. Some project creators do this, so it can't be *too* difficult.

It's like standing in line at a Disney ride. You know you're going to be standing waiting for a long time. But, provide us with the illusion of motion, and we're totally content to wait.

(If anyone at Kings Wild is listening, I hope they'll consider this suggestion.)

[Stepchild]

Straws. I am out of them.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

[sinjin7]

No, it wasn't cool to let others get the display deck.

Jackson said in one of his videos that he has a hard time putting in text what he can say out loud. I know it was in reaction to us backers being angry about some change he did to a card deck or lack of updates or something.

As for Delanie she needs some updating work. Sure saying "all is on track" doesn't cut it. I don't know about her messaging responses, if she or Jackson handles that. Marcus was excellent.

Jackson has a hard time putting in text what he can say out loud? Really? So it's easier to set up all the equipment, shoot the video (possibly taking multiple takes in doing it), edit the video, take the time to upload it to YouTube, and then link it all to a KS update than it is to sit down and simply type a paragraph or two? Please. I think he's just trying to build up his YouTube channel by forcing us to watch his videos through KS. It's actually kind of genius in a narcissistic, it's-all-about-me-screw-the-convenience-of-my-backers kind of way.

Jackson is damned if he does, damned if he doesn't in many regards, but it's mainly self-inflicted. Take the "display" deck for instance. Initially, you could only get it by pledging for an uber-expensive tier. People will inevitably complain about not being able to get access to the display deck without taking out another mortgage. So Jackson makes one display deck available to the masses at the last second, which pleases the masses, but screws the very backers who laid out the most money for him. What he should've done was had the "display" deck available to all from the start, or not made the standard deck so inferior (for lack of a better term) than the "limited" deck, imo. He's run enough campaigns to know better, but he does this to squeeze the most money out of his backers (which he is entitled to do) instead of catering to his backers preference and convenience.

Let's take Delanie's updates as another example. Jackson has a crappy track record communicating with his backers after his campaigns end and he has their money, especially when things go wrong production-wise and he goes radio silent as the delays lengthen. So after 20 freaking campaigns, he finally commits to better communication by hiring somebody who's sole purpose is to communicate and update on a weekly basis, and all his backers are giving each other high fives and pats on the back. But then comes the stream of "updates" where all Delanie has to say is, "Welp, nothing new to say, everything is on track. See ya next week!" Which is ironic, because hardly any of Jackson's past projects have been on track. So what's better, radio silence or inane, content-less "updates" on a weekly basis? I guess I'll take the weekly "updates". Hell, if I find the updates too tripe, I can always watch videos of Jackson trying too hard to be goofy. . .

[TGunitedcardists]

Jackson is damned if he does, damned if he doesn't in many regards, but it's mainly self-inflicted. Take the "display" deck for instance. Initially, you could only get it by pledging for an uber-expensive tier. People will inevitably complain about not being able to get access to the display deck without taking out another mortgage. So Jackson makes one display deck available to the masses at the last second, which pleases the masses, but screws the very backers who laid out the most money for him. What he should've done was had the "display" deck available to all from the start, or not made the standard deck so inferior (for lack of a better term) than the "limited" deck, imo. He's run enough campaigns to know better, but he does this to squeeze the most money out of his backers (which he is entitled to do) instead of catering to his backers preference and convenience.

I agree. This is correct, in spirit. For him, hitting $64,000 was also correct play, regardless if it was sketchy how the display deck rollout went, especially last minute.

[Bruno]

Well ....
Besides all that stuff, I went in for my first KW project, got some, then in the midst of all the rising flak, got more ....
Compounded the advantage by adding some, then more.
I think I may have two bricks of these goodies.
I'd give youse a breakdown of the whichwhat, but who here cares ?
....'cept as ammo, pathetically.

[jsantafe]

Not sure what you're saying, but everyone here got some from KWP and still do.
That doesn't mean there's room for improvement specially y campaign management.

[Bruno]

O yair, def. room fer improvement.
Know what I'm sayin'.

[Marcus]

I can't really even see how the display decks and the actual Camelot editions can be comparable. One is a simple, white tuck with black text on it and nothing else. The other is a proper tuck case similar (but not identical) to the Escalibur edition, and on top of that, an actual extra case that is made to look like a book with gilded pages. (Sure, we can play the "but he has failed to deliver on those special thingies in the past" card here, but this is what he is aiming to do, and since he has made prototypes already I expect these to come out the way he plans.)

If anyone feel upset about the display decks being available to everyone and not just the Camelot backers, by all means - everyone's entitled to their own opinion. But claiming it was done "last minute" or "last second" and calling it "sketchy" (actual quotes here, guys) is quite the stretch. JR sent out an update to everyone mentioning it both in the headline and the actual update, and it was done on March 17th - 18 whole days before the campaign ended. That's 25,920 last minutes, or 1,555,200 last seconds, and clearly communicated to everyone concerned.

If discussions could be kept at a more reasonable and less hyperbole level everyone involved would benefit.

(To those expressing kind words about my time there - I appreciate it very much and it warms this old man's heart.)

[vasta41]

If discussions could be kept at a more reasonable and less hyperbole level everyone involved would benefit.

While everything else you said may be right, until Jackson actually communicates with us here, our discussions can be as "unreasonable" or "hyperbolic" as we want. Because there are still many questions we all have about his recent decisions that are unanswered to this point. Now Jackson doesn't need to come here and explain himself if he doesn't want to but he has caused a lot of backer frustration and without hearing it from the horses mouth we have nothing else to do but speculate. Suggesting any sort of censorship on this matter is preposterous IMO. Jackson is in a different boat than these two guys but if it weren't for this outspoken forum we might never have seen the Mana Sybl decks OR a refund for Imperium. I don't expect Jackson to just stop and change everything he's doing just to appease us but my point is I believe that everyone here benefits when we are outspoken (on matters of playing cards).

[Bruno]

Yesyes.
But could we excise the blowhardy fabricated critiquing, the insipid weasely whining and moaning, and the leave right out the dangerous underlying subtext of **contempt from some ?
Says more about the posters themselves than anything Jackson could willingly/unwillingly propose.

edit.
** insert >absolute< as neccessary.

[Marcus]

If discussions could be kept at a more reasonable and less hyperbole level everyone involved would benefit.

While everything else you said may be right, until Jackson actually communicates with us here, our discussions can be as "unreasonable" or "hyperbolic" as we want. Because there are still many questions we all have about his recent decisions that are unanswered to this point. Now Jackson doesn't need to come here and explain himself if he doesn't want to but he has caused a lot of backer frustration and without hearing it from the horses mouth we have nothing else to do but speculate. Suggesting any sort of censorship on this matter is preposterous IMO. Jackson is in a different boat than these two guys but if it weren't for this outspoken forum we might never have seen the Mana Sybl decks OR a refund for Imperium. I don't expect Jackson to just stop and change everything he's doing just to appease us but my point is I believe that everyone here benefits when we are outspoken (on matters of playing cards).

You're free to be as reasonable or unreasonable (your word) as you prefer. My point is that when discussions fall to the level of not even being factual anymore, nobody walks away a winner. There is nothing to be gained from that. Calling it censorship when someone asks for a more level-headed discussion climate is the only thing preposterous here. One can state the opinion that making display decks available to everyone feels unfair to Camelot edition backers without letting it devolve into claims about how it was done in a sketchy way or last minute when it clearly was not.

We can make our points, express our opinions be they positive or negative about decks and companies here without resorting to things that ruin the actual climate of the conversations, like the things I've previously pointed out. That is not censorship - it's reason.

[vasta41]

One can state the opinion that making display decks available to everyone feels unfair to Camelot edition backers without letting it devolve into claims about how it was done in a sketchy way or last minute when it clearly was not.

You are speculating as much as the rest of us. Was it literally done last minute? Of course not- it's an expression as I'm sure you know. Sketchy? That's a relative term. But let's stop splitting hairs. I don't feel as strongly as others on this thread and I'm not defending them nor agreeing with them. All I'm trying to say is until Jackson confirms or denies his motives with the display decks (I'll say it again) we can only speculate. The fact is Jackson and his KWP team isn't as forthright as everyone here wishes they were. But I guess we will just have to agree to disagree on this topic.

[Bruno]

[Redacted by Moderator]

[vasta41]

[Redacted by Moderator]

Bruno- Marcus and I are having a discussion. You are attacking my character. KNOCK IT OFF!

[Bruno]

[Redacted]

[Marcus]

One can state the opinion that making display decks available to everyone feels unfair to Camelot edition backers without letting it devolve into claims about how it was done in a sketchy way or last minute when it clearly was not.

You are speculating as much as the rest of us. Was it literally done last minute? Of course not- it's an expression as I'm sure you know. Sketchy? That's a relative term. But let's stop splitting hairs. I don't feel as strongly as others on this thread and I'm not defending them nor agreeing with them. All I'm trying to say is until Jackson confirms or denies his motives with the display decks (I'll say it again) we can only speculate. The fact is Jackson and his KWP team isn't as forthright as everyone here wishes they were. But I guess we will just have to agree to disagree on this topic.

I'm not really speculating at all there, though. No matter how figuratively one were to interpret the "last minute/second" part, there's no sensible way of it being true. The update was sent out on March 17th. That's on the twelfth day of the projects, with 18 days to go. It's several days closer to the launch date than to the end date, so in this case we'd then have to pretend that "last minute/second" doesn't even mean the second half of the campaign.

And opening up the display decks to all backers may be considered a good or a bad move toward certain backers - that's down to opinion of course. But it's not sketchy in any interpretation of the word when it's done completely in the open, letting everyone know it as publicly as possible in an update with plenty of time left to change or cancel their pledge if they so desire. None of that info was kept from backers, and everyone had a chance to act accordingly.

I'm not here to be JR's knight in shining armor. I'm merely asking that when we discuss things (in general, not just here) we should try our best to not let emotions skew facts too much as that will hinder more than help.

[Cardician_82]

[Redacted.]

Bruno- Marcus and I are having a discussion. You are attacking my character. KNOCK IT OFF!

[Also redacted.]

[JuFiN]

One can state the opinion that making display decks available to everyone feels unfair to Camelot edition backers without letting it devolve into claims about how it was done in a sketchy way or last minute when it clearly was not.

You are speculating as much as the rest of us. Was it literally done last minute? Of course not- it's an expression as I'm sure you know. Sketchy? That's a relative term. But let's stop splitting hairs. I don't feel as strongly as others on this thread and I'm not defending them nor agreeing with them. All I'm trying to say is until Jackson confirms or denies his motives with the display decks (I'll say it again) we can only speculate. The fact is Jackson and his KWP team isn't as forthright as everyone here wishes they were. But I guess we will just have to agree to disagree on this topic.

I'm not really speculating at all there, though. No matter how figuratively one were to interpret the "last minute/second" part, there's no sensible way of it being true. The update was sent out on March 17th. That's on the twelfth day of the projects, with 18 days to go. It's several days closer to the launch date than to the end date, so in this case we'd then have to pretend that "last minute/second" doesn't even mean the second half of the campaign.
.

I think the issue is that the availability of the display decks to all backers was only brought to the attention of this forum within hours of the campaign ending. I for one would have backed for an Excalibur and then added on a display deck had I known that was even an option in time. But as I hadn't backed the project, therefore not seeing the update, and no one posted about it here I missed my chance to do that. So from the prospective of many people on this forum it was very last minute.

It also was never really made clear in the body of the campaign itself so if someone missed that update it could be confusing. Regardless, announcing something as exclusive to a group to try and build that group or to increase the perceived value of the thing and then turning around and removing that exclusivity is something that rubs me the wrong way. Despite that fact that had I known about it earlier I would have probably taken advantage.

[rousselle]

Gentlemen, I am enjoying this discussion about the Arthurian project. Allow me, please, to contribute my own two cents.

Once I learned that display decks would only be available to backers of the Camelot deck, I contemplated the idea of backing the project when a Camelot deck became available. At the time, they were all taken; only the regular decks were available to be pledged for. I was not, at that time, a backer.

When I saw a Camelot deck become available, I backed the project for that tier. I checked the front page to confirm that nothing had changed about the Display deck, and there was no mention of it being available to all backers. This included in the list of updates that were on the project's home page.

What I did not do was go through the updates themselves.

And thus, even though the update did go out on March 17th that display decks were available to all, I wasn't backing at the time and so did not receive that update, and I didn't see any mention to that effect on the front page. That said, there was also no longer mention on the front page that display decks could only be purchased by Camelot backers, and I missed the fact that that was missing.

And so, here we are. I do not think that JR deliberately misled me. I accept full responsibility for missing this fine print. At the same time, I'm annoyed with myself for missing this detail, because I would have preferred to just have the display decks and not the fully tricked-out version. I am not going to ask for a refund, because, again, it's my own damn fault.

But... I can't help but feel a little sore, because it should have been a little more obvious. So... live and learn.

I agree with others who say the display deck idea should have been part of the project from the start, but JR does modify the project as he goes, and sometimes that works to our benefit, and sometimes, it doesn't. So it goes.

[Bruno]

Yay !
More rational.
Less emote.

Lets do that.

[Gareth]

Once I learned that display decks would only be available to backers of the Camelot deck, I contemplated the idea of backing the project when a Camelot deck became available. At the time, they were all taken; only the regular decks were available to be pledged for. I was not, at that time, a backer.

My experience was pretty much the same - except that I decided that Camelot was too expensive for me. (hmm... I must be learning )

Hence, not knowing that the Display decks were available to all, I - and I would suppose some others - did not back this campaign at all.

This is the problem from KWP/Jackson's viewpoint in their relatively limited promotion through the community; a smaller income stream.

[I guess I/we might be able to get a couple of decks in BackerKit, when that comes out]