Shogun Playing Cards

[nur1988]

Hey guys. It's been a while since I've posted anything worthwhile on the forums (mainly PCF). Haven't been very active due to various life obstacles that I was overcoming.
Anyway, all that's settled now and I can move on to something that's near and dear to me.
For those that know me, I am a huge fan of Japanese culture and of course I've always wanted to jump on the playing card design bandwagon. I've been pondering about this idea for a good few months, and I'm slowly starting to work on a Japanese themed deck based loosely on the Tokugawa Shogunates and the Japanese Edo Era. I'm working along side my cousin and we are doing an all hand drawn deck of cards. Here's one of the aces we drew. (I've had to resize and crop as it doesn't allow anything over 1mb)
Hopefully, I can go ahead and create something that would appeal to all. Keep in mind, this is a rough sketch.
Any ideas of what you'd like to see, please throw them my way.

[DanFeldmeier]

Sounds like it could be a pretty cool concept, interested to see where this goes and how the later product looks.

[nur1988]

Hey, thank you. Yeah, the research has been long and winded with this one. Went old school and got a lot of information from books at my local library that wasn't available online.
The only obstacle I've come across are the queens, as they were no meaningful women or samurai women in that era. May do geishas for the queens. Wouldbe done the wives of some of the Tokugawa's but there's little info about them.
But I will have fully colored pictures up soon
My original concept was totally different to this though, this is way better.

[RichK]

I like the concept. Going old school to a library must have lots of info.

Geisha's sound good to me, especially if they date back that far.

Glad this concept is way better than original. Looking forward to your progress.

[nur1988]

I like the concept. Going old school to a library must have lots of info.

Geisha's sound good to me, especially if they date back that far.

Glad this concept is way better than original. Looking forward to your progress.

It certainly did have a lot of hidden information surrounding the edo era. A lot of research notes I looked into. Geisha have been around for centuries, women during the edo era were mainly just women of the household. There were women entertainers, and of course Geisha being, what we would call them as, "the lady of the night". I believe they were known as sabaruko girls. During the edo era, wives were never used for sexual pleasure. Shogunates created a yukaku which is our modern day red light district.
However, the queens that we'll be doing will be a little more tasteful lol

The original concept were to have the tokugawa crest on the AoS and represent the moon. Same with the AoC. And then the AoH and AoD were going to represent the sun. The idea in my head seemed really good, once I put pencil to paper, it was very blah. And the courts were going to be 12 out of the 15 Shogunates, and that looked kinda crap too as only a handful had any real impact during the edo era. It'll take us a while to complete it all, but it will be a very artistic deck, going forward

[nur1988]

Would anyone be subjected to this if it were printed by cartamundi?
Was going to go with LPCC, but after getting the DMC Elites, the handling was just so awesome.

[RichK]

I don't know what cartamundi can do vs LPCC but people may shy away from your project if not from the "big 3". And it depends on what features, foil, embossing, metallic ink, etc. you want.

Ultimately it comes down to your card designs in my opinion. You're going custom courts which is a plus for me. I don't understand why some decks, see the Amethyst deck picture in the "New Decks" section, and it's just a fancy purple back with I bet standard courts and pips. Boring to me but I bet it funds/sells a lot when it happens. Same with NOC. I don't get it but people buy them up.

Do the art since I assume that will take time then worry about printing. Who knows what advancements or failures may come from cartamundi or LPCC.

[nur1988]

I don't know what cartamundi can do vs LPCC but people may shy away from your project if not from the "big 3". And it depends on what features, foil, embossing, metallic ink, etc. you want.

Ultimately it comes down to your card designs in my opinion. You're going custom courts which is a plus for me. I don't understand why some decks, see the Amethyst deck picture in the "New Decks" section, and it's just a fancy purple back with I bet standard courts and pips. Boring to me but I bet it funds/sells a lot when it happens. Same with NOC. I don't get it but people buy them up.

Do the art since I assume that will take time then worry about printing. Who knows what advancements or failures may come from cartamundi or LPCC.

Yeah, I've seen that design done a few times. It looked ok on the Shards playing cards by system 6, even then it was blah.

Things like NOC are popular due to the company name and magicians that are attached to it, they have a following who will buy anything they put out, which is understandable.

Yeah, that's true regarding the printer, I was on the fence with Cartamundi, but the handling of dmc elites had me thinking. But,yeah,i understand what you mean about people being a little put off if it weren't the big 3.

Ill post some more hand drawn stuff this weekend. I'm hoping to have a fully finished deck before it goes on kickstarter.

Thanks again

[RichK]

I don't know what cartamundi can do vs LPCC but people may shy away from your project if not from the "big 3". And it depends on what features, foil, embossing, metallic ink, etc. you want.

Ultimately it comes down to your card designs in my opinion. You're going custom courts which is a plus for me. I don't understand why some decks, see the Amethyst deck picture in the "New Decks" section, and it's just a fancy purple back with I bet standard courts and pips. Boring to me but I bet it funds/sells a lot when it happens. Same with NOC. I don't get it but people buy them up.

Do the art since I assume that will take time then worry about printing. Who knows what advancements or failures may come from cartamundi or LPCC.

Yeah, I've seen that design done a few times. It looked ok on the Shards playing cards by system 6, even then it was blah.

Things like NOC are popular due to the company name and magicians that are attached to it, they have a following who will buy anything they put out, which is understandable.

Yeah, that's true regarding the printer, I was on the fence with Cartamundi, but the handling of dmc elites had me thinking. But,yeah,i understand what you mean about people being a little put off if it weren't the big 3.

Ill post some more hand drawn stuff this weekend. I'm hoping to have a fully finished deck before it goes on kickstarter.

Thanks again

I would suggest having a full deck done and post pictures, card backs, tuck box ideas, etc. here so other members can offer advice on what's good or bad. Little tweaks can help make your ideas even better. I don't like Kickstarter projects that just show a few cards and you don't see the courts or custom pips so you hope the rest will look good when pledging.

[nur1988]

I would suggest having a full deck done and post pictures, card backs, tuck box ideas, etc. here so other members can offer advice on what's good or bad. Little tweaks can help make your ideas even better. I don't like Kickstarter projects that just show a few cards and you don't see the courts or custom pips so you hope the rest will look good when pledging.

Me and you both. I'm not a huge fan of little teasers.
I'll definitely be posting full cards and sketches alike up on here for people to see

[RichK]

Excellent!

[nur1988]

Here's an updated version of all 4 aces. Not yet complete as we still need to add the indices.
Many hours were put into designing these, especially by my cousin, so I hope you all will like them.
Courts coming up in the next couple of weeks.
Please let me know what you think.
Thanks again

[DanFeldmeier]

Totally diggin' this! Can't wait to see more!

[RichK]

I like it but think the line art needs to be heavier. Have you "shrunk" it down to card size to see what details get lost?

[nur1988]

I like it but think the line art needs to be heavier. Have you "shrunk" it down to card size to see what details get lost?

Hey, yup, will be darkening the lines a little more, especially on the AoC as the carp doesn't pop as much as I wanted it to.

I have, not much detail has been lost on it, but I'll defo put it up to show you guys so I can gather more feedback.

Thank you again

[TGunitedcardists]

I live in Japan and this deck interests me. The artwork is a good start. Do you have ideas for a back design? Suggestions: a river of koi, cherry blossoms etc ukiyo-e style. I'm looking forward to seeing more.

[nur1988]

I live in Japan and this deck interests me. The artwork is a good start. Do you have ideas for a back design? Suggestions: a river of koi, cherry blossoms etc ukiyo-e style. I'm looking forward to seeing more.

Hey, thank you, I appreciate your comment.

I was looking at ukiyo-e style but I'm considering using it for some woodblock printing, but I'm a little on the fence due to the complexity.

I've chopped and changed the back design idea a lot. I'm not happy with it at the moment so haven't put anything up, this sunday I will be posting some court cards.

I'm incorporating the crest on the back design and hoping to apply all the bells and whistles to make it pop.

[nur1988]

sketches of the Jacks

[shermjack]

I really like how this deck is developing, but have a couple comments:

1. AoD looks good except for the fact that the two samurai are leaning inward, which seems awkward and forced so that they form part of the diamond.

2. The AoH and AoC, though they look great, don't seem to go with the Shogun theme

3. The AoS looks pretty good except for the black streak running down the middle that starts at the man sitting at the top of the stairs...what is the black streak supposed to be? Is the man supposed to be a Shogun and if so, can you differntiate it a little more (maybe add a sword or have him dressed in his military outfit)

Jacks look great and I am definitely liking the majority of this deck...look forward to seeing it continue to develop.

[nur1988]

I really like how this deck is developing, but have a couple comments:

1. AoD looks good except for the fact that the two samurai are leaning inward, which seems awkward and forced so that they form part of the diamond.

2. The AoH and AoC, though they look great, don't seem to go with the Shogun theme

3. The AoS looks pretty good except for the black streak running down the middle that starts at the man sitting at the top of the stairs...what is the black streak supposed to be? Is the man supposed to be a Shogun and if so, can you differntiate it a little more (maybe add a sword or have him dressed in his military outfit)

Jacks look great and I am definitely liking the majority of this deck...look forward to seeing it continue to develop.

Hi Shermack, thank you for your kind words and the feedback, it really is much appreciated

Just to give a little bit of back ground information regarding the deck.

The deck is mainly based on the Tokugawa Shogunates reign, in particular Tokugawa Ieyasu. He formed this new reign starting off the Edo era and it carried on for over 250 years.

1. It was intentional for the samurai to form the diamonds. My vision for the Aces were to have the whole area filled. We tried putting them inside the diamonds and it didn't look so good.
2. We struggled with what to put for the hearts and clubs. As we didn't want all 4 aces to have all samurai in it, we went with what would have been around the time of Ieyasu. With the clubs, we used carp, red carp in particular were popular around the Edo era.
For the Hearts, we decided to go with a woman with a traditional Japanese fan and the guy playing the Shamisen. It was a time of restoring faith into the system, things were a little calmer when Ieyasu took over and he, somewhat, restored order. This is to kind of represent that.
3. AoS, is Ieyasu sitting with his Komainu (lion dogs) guards. The black strip is meant to be the carpet draping down the stairs. It does need clean up, so I'll make sure that does look better.

I will be producing like a pdf or booklet with the historical info when the project begins.

[JuFiN]

I agree that the AoD looks a little forced, but I rather like the other aces. Maybe on AoD have the holding their swords to form the top of the diamond shape. Hopefully that suggestion makes sense.

[nur1988]

these are still 1st sketches. My next post will show the kings, then queens.

That will be followed by the joker, back and tuck.

Then, finally, any revisions. Will be tweaking the AoD, it is on the list

[sms69x]

It is coming together very well! Really liking it! Congrats.

Only thing I would point out is to keep some traditional features, like one eyed jack, suicide king, one eyed king....

[nur1988]

It is coming together very well! Really liking it! Congrats.

Only thing I would point out is to keep some traditional features, like one eyed jack, suicide king, one eyed king....

Thank you, your support is generous

In regards to the traditional features, we have kept to a couple here and there but it's more notable on the Kings and Queens. As for the one eyed jack, I will certainly take the feedback on bored, the only thing I'm concerned about is he would have to be facing sideways, which would be out of context with the rest of them. I suppose we could do it as a gouged eye though. I'll discuss it with my cousin and see what we can do

Please check out the Kings and our Pip design below. Again, feedback is very much welcome particularly on the pips.

Coming up, the Queens.

[nur1988]

Custom Pips

[nur1988]

Here are 1st sketches of the Queens. Geisha in their most vulnerable form.

Unfortunately, there were no women of any outright significance during the Edo era, however, Geisha girls were the answer to every man's sexual needs. There was nothing in place to state Japanese men had to be faithful to their wives. It was never considered taboo by their Shinto religion.

Nowadays, Geisha are known for much more, some may call it a type of art form. As well as being a companion, they're also associated with music, dance and acting -they perform for both male and female.

However, during the Edo period, Ieyasu and the Tokugawa clan, built "pleasure quarters". What we refer to, now, as a red light district. Any prostitution outside these quarters would be deemed illegal. They were known as yūjo (play women) and would have to be licensed. There were different status of yūjo, the highest status being Tayuu (combo of actress and prostitute).
If anyone has ever heard or come across a Kabuki Theatre, it was because of this. They dubbed the art form as Kabuku and the name of the dance Kabuki.

Hope you like the drawings, my cousin really put a lot of time and effort into all these drawings (while juggling his job and family too) and would apreciate any kind of feedback regarding these.

[RichK]

Nice work. Can you put pupils in the cards without them, they look odd.

Pips don't seem to have connection. I like the Spade but the Club looks like it's got fuzz on it when you shrunk it down. Hearts and Diamonds aren't doing it for me either. Maybe have design inside all non Spade pips vs "cutting" the other 3 edges off.

[intlgrrl]

These pictures look amazing, I can't wait to see what you do with the rest of the deck

[nur1988]

Nice work. Can you put pupils in the cards without them, they look odd.

Pips don't seem to have connection. I like the Spade but the Club looks like it's got fuzz on it when you shrunk it down. Hearts and Diamonds aren't doing it for me either. Maybe have design inside all non Spade pips vs "cutting" the other 3 edges off.

Apologies for the lack of communication, with our day job and doing this it consumes alot of time. I've certainly taken everything on board, will be looking to add pupils and have redesigned the pips too. I agree, in my head they looked amazing, on paper, they looked good too. Once coloured, it kind of lost its edge lol

I shall update very soon. Working on the back design, slight struggle with it, but we will preservere and bring you something, hopefully, aesthetically pleasing. Thank you again for all the support guys.

[cartamundicards]

The aces already look awesome! can't wait to see more!